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I'm glad you believe what you do Guily. It leaves the quality products for the rest of us that enjoy them.

FLAC pulls the data off the CD perfectly. FLAC = CD quality. MP3 is only about 1/3 the bitrate of normal FLAC but it's done in a way that makes it seem good.

I have some 320KBs MP3's too. I just try to get FLAC whenever possible. MP3 is necessary for portable devices, I have 128KBs on my phone but only because there's no difference due to the DAC/headphone amp being utter shit.

But on your desktop or laptop, there's no reason not to have FLAC. I have some FLAC songs that are 100MB each

Anyway, I brought it up for Guily who seems to be interested in quality yet listens to MP3's.

*EDIT* Koden made a point that I tried making earlier but his execution was better.

Of course Creative is saying that. They want to sell more! The question is, why are you listening to MP3's in the first place? FLAC or GTFO. As for hating Sony speakers, I don't think they've ever made anything good in speakers but you can't rate modern stuff. Same for JBL. No manufacturer makes them like they used to.

Car audio doesn't count either as most people there just want bass and nothing else. Not to mention all the reflections inside a car and the ambient noise when driving, it's far from ideal for listening.

Vintage Sony amps are fantastic if you ever have the chance to listen to one.

As far as modern materials in speakers, I don't know what the advantages are but I do know that modern speakers don't sound as good as vintage ones. It's a fact. It's why 40 year old speakers cost so much. A lot of the JBL speakers from back then were built without a budget. Meaning, the best they could possibly make. What manufacturer does that now? It's all about Made in China at a low budget. I challenge you to try and find a modern speaker that's made in the USA, not just assembled in the USA with Chinese components.

Why would you crank headphones that high on a receiver? That's just abuse.

If you ever have the chance, try a real stereo setup. None of this multichannel crap. Somehow get a hold of some 3-way vintage speakers and an amplifier capable of driving them properly. I KNOW for a fact that your Logitech system is highly lacking mids. Those little satelite speakers are fine for highs and the subwoofer puts out bloated lows but you're not getting mids from anywhere. I know, I had a Logitech setup and it's absolutely night and day difference between it and a real speaker & amplifier setup.

I had a HUGE 5.1 Dell setup where the amp/subwoofer was larger and heavier than a desktop computer:

I hated it, even after using it for a week trying to get used to it and tweaking it. I was using my X-Fi card at the time too. It was way too loud and those satelite speakers just can't output a decent dynamic range at all. When you have good speakers, you don't need a subwoofer. They're really only for multichannel home theater enthusiasts that need the big boom and BIC makes some pretty good subwoofers for that purpose.

I'm really not trying to sound all high and mighty and that MY WAY IS THE BEST WAY. I'm just simply talking from experience. I've had a lot of those "gamer" components and I don't have any of them anymore. I've reached a point where I'm 100% happy with my audio setup.

I hear details in music and games that I've never heard before. One minor silly example is how the M16 shot in AA echoes on for several seconds after you fire. I hear things with great clarity. Properly placed and angled speakers allow you to have an experience that I can only describe as up front and personal. You don't have to crank the volume to hear details, it's like the audio is being piped directly from the speakers into your brain. It doesn't sound like it's coming from any specific direction. That's the only way I can describe it.

If I am trying to find a speaker and amp set up what brands should I look out for?

For an amp, stay away from anything with a LCD display, the simpler the front and back is, the better. Generally ones Made in Japan pre-90's are good. Anything too old might need work. A lot of pre-80's stuff needs new capacitors, even some 90's stuff does. If you come across one, look the model number up on eBay, completed listings. Generally junker units never sell and you'll see one that was listed several times. Popular good quality units sell pretty frequently and you'll get an idea of the going rate. Higher end units will tend to have bridged mode, allowing you to hook 2 amps together, kind of like SLI or Crossfire, one amp per speaker. Real metal/aluminum fronts mean that they're older. Solid feeling knobs and switches are good too. The Sony ES series is very popular and has held it's value for quite a while.

For speakers, they're easier to tell. A serial number is a good start. Real wood veneer hints at higher end. The heavier they are, the better. It means they used thick plywood to assemble it and it's built well to eliminate resonance. If you see them in person, take a flathead and phillips screwdriver to remove the woofer. The size of magnet will tell you a lot about it. Bigger magnet is better, bigger ones will also be quite a bit heavy. Once that's out, take a look at the crossover circuit inside. Larger components on a dedicated circuit board or piece of MDF is a good sign. Low end speakers will have a capacitor or resistor stuck in the wire. If the woofer has "China", "Indonesia" or some other foreign location stamped on it, it's low end. Quality ones will have the manufacturer's logo on it and is likely to be made in the USA. While the woofer is still removed, feel how heavy the box is. If it's still ungodly heavy, that's good. See if there's foam inside to help reduce resonance and reflections. Cheaper speakers sometimes don't have foam or maybe they will have eggcrate style foam. My vintage speakers have a fiberglass kind of foam, like you would insulate your house with, real thick and soft. Finally, keep in mind that the woofers may need new foam surrounds. If they do, you can probably get the speakers for cheap as it takes $30 or so for a repair kit and some time/knowledge to fix them (I had to do it twice).

Here's some pictures of my speakers to kind of give you an idea of the features/looks that I'm talking about. Mine aren't high end, they're more middle of the road home style speakers, not super serious 3-way studio speakers with multiple woofers.
Deteroriated foam surround:

Cleaned woofer basket for new foam surround:

Cabinet after some sanding and a few coats of watco danish oil:

New foam surround in place:

Backside with high frequency adjust knob:

Stock crossover circuit:

Modded & upgraded crossover circuit:


Beautiful result:

If the amp killed headphones, it was likely malfunctioning, outputting DC offset which makes the driver coils work against themselves causing heat which will destroy the driver in time.

Those Logitech speakers were probably reviewed by computer sites or gaming sites. You won't find them reviewed on audio forums because they aren't even considered worthwhile by enthusiasts. Those computer or gaming sites that reviewed them probably compared them to other crappy 2.1 systems made by Logitech, Creative, Insignia or some other Walmart brand.

When you really start researching, no modern speakers/amps can be considered high quality unless you're talking several thousand dollar hand-built in the USA specialty units. Companies just don't make them like they used to. Vintage is where it's at. Japanese-made amplifiers made in the 60's, 70's, 80's and sometimes 90's have true quality built in them. Quality speakers were often made in the US with thick marine-grade plywood covered with a quality veneer.

Quality multi-channel systems are difficult to have. You generally have to find a good multi-channel receiver and do research on what speakers play well with each other. Speakers in a box or prebuilt systems like Logitech's are never the way to go.

Z5500

*facepalm* Even Skrewy knows better than to get Logitech speakers... No wonder you think X-Fi cards sound good. You probably care more about multi-channel than speaker placement or accurate sound reproduction.