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Yeah, even the very little ones I bought made in China, I almost couldn't pull them away.

But it's not just that they increased prices, they have always been expensive, because they are not just a special magnet, they are really a RARE MATERIAL on this planet (unless someone discover tons of miles of them).

And if you read up you see why would you rather use then in high fidelity equipment of any kind (sound, and any kind of electronics).


So why would the best high fidelity expensive amplifiers of nowadays are worst if they have all the best components ever produced known by humanity. Crazy new designs hardly tested with computers, the best of two worlds, Super powerfull computers (way more powerfull than ur PC) together with the best amplifying components just to produce sound. That's just what modern expensive high fidelity systems are, they are pure advanced computers with the best used components, and the use of gold on all the motherboard connections instead of copper and blahblahblah so many technologies that were discovered over the years.

How can that be worst than the 80's amps? (Which probably didn't even had a way to test the so called Hi fidelity they had). I already heard to some expensive Hi-fi sound systems studio kind, and I don't think the amplification as ever been so clean!

BUT, I'm still happier with a PC with a good sound card, with a good headphones, and some home cinema speakers instead of hi-fi systems (which are getting old nowadays, as everyone is going for the home cinema kind of sound). I guess people just prefer to exchange high fidelity to the rumble of the subwoofer (I'm one of those). But I do realize that if you still want some real high fidelity system, you can still have them better than ever, it will just cost too much and a normal person won't enjoy it (unless your a composer and music producer).
 Keep Cool

Can you provide frequency response or RMAA measurements for the X-Mini? You say they have great quality but then you say it distorts. Keep your story straight. I did reading and people like it for being the best PORTABLE speaker but I have yet to come across studios or home theater setups using them.

X-mini 2:

Dimension:60 mm×44mm (closed resonator)
Net Weight:83g
Speaker:Magnetically Shielded 40mm (4Ω)
Loudspeaker Output:2.5W
Frequency Response:100Hz - 20kHz
Signal-to-Noise:≥80dB
Distortion:≤1.0%
Playback Time:Up to 12 hours
Battery Capacity:400mAh
Battery Charging Voltage:5V
Battery Charge Time:Minimum of 2.5 hours.

Go see them on youtube (though you will never hear their quality, which can only be heard in real life). And they do have an impressive quality, since the coil is the size of my current headphones (40mm). They do sound like the sound of kinda a 2.1 system (not with that much rumble of a subwoofer, but plenty enough 4 what they are).

But As I said they kinda make distortions on some music (almost all will play very awesome), but there are still some that has some distortion, but seriously they are pure quality, I could never ask that much 4 what they are.

They probably have distortions, because instead of them trying to make it sound like a crap by letting it reproduce only higher frequencies, that little thing actually is good reproducing any frequency, even the lowest which are made for a subwoofer (the very deep frequencies aren't heard, but the speaker starts jumping all over the place ). I'm not saying they are high quality in Hi-fi standards, they are no fidelity for that standards.

But come on for what they really are, they are pretty damn good, and at least 8h of play I get from them always kicking hard : And what I loved even more, was that inside the simple package, comes a paper advertizing the poverty we have in the world, I think it even came with a picture of a unhealthy kid.

ps: I had some cheap copies of it, and they actually had no distortions (unless on full volume), but the quality damn, it was almost just as high as the ones on the laptop it self, they had no mids or low frequencies. X-mini really have them (and can go pretty damn loud if u want to remove all it's quality by equalizing the mid-higher frequencies to full).

The drivers you're talking about were likely abused but that doesn't surprise me from the way you talk about your equipment.

Well If beside the quality, the equipment is not made to be used 24/7 on it's full rated RMS power (constant power, nothing to do with the peak power), well then they are not reliable for people like me.

Back to your claim of CPU processing for audio being good and making things sound better. You claimed a lot that those sound cards like Auzentech and Creative are the best for processing. It's funny because I don't see those listed anywhere in the top 50 DACs on Head-Fi...
http://www.head-fi.org/products/category/amp-dacs
They're all straight pathways without any CPU processing.

Well, there are Hi-fi... PC gaming systems with special proccessing features.... DJ type sound... professional type sound...

PC gaming components never are rated by the music companies, they always have a very different part. But are they good? Well hear the enemy before they hear you. That's what I have to say about them, they are not made to be used in a studio, and that's they way it will be.

But actually some custom made equipment for some DJ's have a CPU even more powerful than all your computer, so I bet that mixed with good hardware pre-amp connected to a pro-amp, I bet it's something from other planet right? That's why we can nowadays make people with bad voice to be a world famous singer (digital, not analogic).

But the question is, did YOU measure it? Do YOU have proof that the drivers lost magnetism?

You don't seem to have any proof to back up your statements.

As for the resistance changing, that's either old components in the crossover (again, anybody that knows quality speakers will know to upgrade/overhaul vintage speaker crossovers) or shorts developing in the coil from abuse.

That X Mini you mentioned, it falls in the same category as laptops. Portability comes first, performance is not a priority. People that search for speakers like that generally want them as loud as possible without any care for quality/performance. It is impossible to make portable speakers that sound as good as full-size ones, it's physics.

About my measuring tests it's easy... As I said I have really lot's and lot's of magnets from old engines... They are very little magnets (have little from from speakers too), which I have been saving over the years.

But I can clearly, clearly see that they lost almost all their magnetic power, now they don't lift much weight like they used to. They are little pieces, so you won't probably notice much the power of magnet lost in a speaker because it has a huge magnet and since it's huge you will always note a good magnet power field, but I'm 110% sure they aren't the same as they used to be...


About fixing the old speakers, well, the membrane get's screwed over years (you will use a modern one, which is crappy since nowadays you claim we have no quality)... Then the spiders or whatever u call it, which is what makes it shake to a certain place only, get way too soft over years, that's probably the hearth of the driver, so you will put a modern one, then you will make them sound like a crap since you say the materials nowadays are worst... (why would you buy an old coil which you only like the older ones, and then have it half old, half modern?).

And about the XMINI, your damn wrong. They aren't much louder than the speakers I have in this laptop, but they sound just like if I had a Wi-Fi kind of sound... They really reproduce the lower frequencies pretty good, hell even lower than the hi-fi systems, they really even shake like a damn subwoofer. I recently bought it, and now I have 5 guys always pissing me of to buy more from the internet, because they want it too.


And the why those little speakers are loud enough and with good quality, much is their magnets. I bet they use neodymnium, because I had other portable speakers like X-mini, but from a crappy brand, that had a very bad amplifier that got burned in 5 minutes. I removed everything, and the magnet inside was neodymnium, The screwdriver got glued to the metal around that magnet, it looks like you glue them, you have to make a lot of strength to take it out.

And it was just a very tiny magnet. If you use the most powerful normal magnet of the same size, it will not even have a quarter of it's strength. So I don't wanna even imagine a big coil with a huge neodymnium magnets, they will probable destroy a CRT completely from one meter away of it in less than a second.

ps: Bad quality means high DB, but actually X-mini is loud enough, but has a freakin awesome quality for what they look (but some frequencies make it kinda to make distortions, which doesn't matter).
Keep Cool

Well I don't really care much 4 that.

If someone is willing to make it, I will use it, if not whateva...

It's good on some point and bad on the other...


It's good because there are maps that someone has advantage over the other team, and if at half of the rounds it would switch, it could become a way to equilibrating more the teams.

On the other hand, there's lot's of newbies that just like to camp on defense, and it could change and they will probably not even realize they have changed to assault...
Keep Cool

15-20 years... only maybe in your hands. I would blow them in a year...

Nothing that used old capacitors got alive that much time in my hands...

My father's old KEF speakers which were pretty cool, are all screwed, it's better to buy a new coil than fixing them, also they are so old, that the magnets already lost some of it's power, just like the ones JBL you have. But you say newer are bad, well I loved the professional JBL 1000W RMS 2-way speakers I had, I bet the quality is like 10x better than ur's.

All the components are screwed cause I listened to Slipknot at full power, that thing was awesome until they started getting hot, and now 10 minutes on high volume the speakers start to blink a red light, until it stop making sound...

And the technics class A amplifier is fucked too... All those old good quality systems can't be used to kick hard like modern speakers 24/7...


At least nowadays even the crappy speakers (with lot less quality than vantage 80's speakers) last longer. Even my logitech crappy Z5500 go beyond their full capabilities for all day long, and they are still punching. For not talking about the my 2.1 super crap creative ones which I increase a lot the outputs in a pre-amp, that the speakers even go beyond their power, there's so many distortions, the amplification dies, but it always come back, they don't wanna die on me .

And newer subwoofer have a crazy excursion, after all they make your house to go down into pieces.

I love subwoofers even if they are way out of the so called high fidelity speakers, which I don't even care about them.


ps: Now talking about high fidelity expensive speakers of nowadays, they are still build like the old way, but use better materials...
Keep Cool

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bass_reflex
Right, exactly what early 70's JBL speakers had. You're talking pure shit.

Yeah I couldn't remember that it was on the early 70's, but I knew they already had that bass reflex port, what I was saying is that all kinds of technology they invented to get better sounds, are always used in any kind of audio system, no matter if it has crap components or good components.

Listening to him is like looking at car audio specs claiming 5000watts of peak power written in bright red and other stupid shit. So the dude installs the lowest quality Gemini speakers that are at the same level as Pyle. Your pro audio buddy will know what I'm talking about. The dude claims he did so many "pro" installations and yada yada. Well, to make the story short, the system sounds terrible. There used to be some real nice vintage Zeniths and some ancient power amp. Those sounded great, but I wouldn't be surprised if some incompetent people hooked up stuff wrong when doing performances and blew something. Because I still don't know why the dude made the new sound installation.

Drop them in a situation where they are forever intimidated by intelligent people and they will change.

Well actually I don't care about car audio, never said they were top quality, they are made to have dirty power...

What I was saying is high fidelity speakers from nowadays are higher fidelity than the ones from the 80's, specially they all test them in computers, and a very very low margin of error, the speakers are canceled (that's how it works on current high quality models).


And I can say the same to all of you, can't discuss anything ether.


On forums all you can get from all the pros is:

-> Old bikes are better and more reliable;
-> Old cars are lot better;
-> Old airguns used to shoot better;
-> Old computers used to have better construction and would not break in a few time.

Well my answer to all of them is wrong, wrong, wrong. Newer good bikes are the top on reliability, have lot more efficiency, less dirty, more economics, same for the cars, and 60hp nowadays is lot different than a 60hp (on the cars, not bikes of 2strokes vs 4 strokes) from way back. Old airguns? Then they don't know airguns that kill huge boars.

Always had computers for a long time, all of them got broken very fast, and in fact the one that lasted long was from 2006, always 24\7 on until 2010. And what I used to pay for an old pc, it had pretty bad components, not much copper used at all, crappy heatsinks... Nowadays I have a 3slot GPU, lot's and lot's of aluminium, lot's of copper, freakin awesome build quality and very solid...

ps: Same goes with the sound, newer high fidelity amplifiers are ensured to make no distortions or noise in the signals, some you can put lot's of wattage power and near max volume and omg the speakers sound like they are off, nothing of noise... WHATEVER

Where do you get your information? I'm talking purely from experience and knowledge I've learned through professional audio forums.

As I said creative don't actually reverse the compression, but what they do affects the music and in my opinion for better even if they are far away from high fidelity, I always loved their effects EAX...

About the speakers, there's a club here which is the most known of the entire island, they organize lot's of raves too with international dj's like carl cox and so... They use high fidelity speakers in their club, it's not to make loud, but to have high quality. But I still prefered a billion times when they even added some dirty power of a crazy HUGE subwoofer that they now have.

I also prefer home cinema and newer technology systems to the so called high fidelity full range ones from the studio. Y? Well because instead of having a coil that loses all it's power trying to reproduce all the frequencies, I prefer having lot's of speakers, each reproducing a certain frequency only and then with the addition of a subwoofer (+woofer 4 punch).

And my other reason is the high-fidelity speakers at very low volumes like 20db, 30db, don't sound powerfull, while with a subwoofer even at the lowest volume it make you think you still are hearing the punch and shake of the high fidelity speakers on high volume.


And since you guys are all sound engineers, go pick some amplifier schematics from one of the best amplifiers of the 80's or whatever... Buy the original, and remake it only using our top components of nowadays (equivalent ones), like solid capacitors, a thicker board with lot more conductivity, modern copper heatsink design with a fan.... modern high quality mosfet's or any other type of amp u wanna use...

And then come here and tell me which one has more noise in the sound waves, which one consume more, and which one heat more and finally the mix of all, which one has more efficiency? (yeah, think on that, and remember even if most companies just want money, there's always some who still enjoy making high quality products).


An example of a "not bad" hi-fi amplifier is this:

It's only 2 outputs and 180w of power, but this thing cost around 500€ (~658$). Why it cost so much for such low power and options? Well because it's construction is built the old way, but with good modern components, and this is not something near studio quality, but you can't say we don't have quality nowadays.

You can't compare this 500€ amp with only 180w to a cheap 1000w amplifier that cost 100€... What is good still cost a lot, like in the 80's, but back then you didn't have much cheap systems to buy.

ps: this is my opinion, so if you don't like it, I don't care, go buy your vintage speakers from the 80's or whatever you wanna buy, and I will be very happy with the modern high fidelity amplifiers.
Keep Cool

Hahaha I grew up hearing those synthesizers. I know a lot of people might not like how it sounds, but it's cool equipment. I see they sell a lot of PA stuff over where you live. It's the same thing in my country. PA's, synthesizers, and mixers. Amazing in a way.

Yep

Before I was born my father's had one casio very old one, it looks like a toy against the modern CASIO kinda pro from the 90's, and that was just a joke against this new modern yamaha...

Also in the 80's you could have had nothing like those new yamaha's with EFFECTS from other planet (it's all in one), they do have lot's of high quality components, but they also still cost way too much. My brother's yamaha cost like 500€ from germany and it's considered a crap for this modern days.

Roland has some bad ass moden models god damn (so much€€€), but they never lost quality, they always increase quality as long with the newer good amplifiers+speakers.


I also love the music box (or whatever you call it), wich you can 4 example connect the synthesizer to it and make pure electro house music
Keep Cool