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Community => The Lounge => Topic started by: soupcakes on Tuesday, April 03, 2012, 06:12:38 AM
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The idea of Anonymous is an interesting concept. It's just made up of regular people like you and me, and it could be anyone and everyone who choses to call themself anonymous. "Anonymous is a decentralized network of individuals focused on promoting access to information, free speech, and transparency".
However, they use illegal measures to hack into websites, steal information and send it to wiki leaks or other uncensored media. They pretty much hack into everything, fbi website, national security, police departments, fox news, cnn, fbi phone calls ect ect, theres no limit and no real way to stop the attacks. And for this, anyone associated with Anonymous can be labeled a terrorist, which now thanks to National security act, means that those who are labeled a terrorist dont even have a right to court.
Another interesting thing is, they claim they will expose all the corruption of the Government by Dec 21 2012. Basically are against laws such as the patriot act, national defense act, sopa and ACTA.
And in other countries that have censorship internet, they make it so people can talk freely about their country and government and give them ways around the censorship.
So the question is, are they terrorists because of the unconventional/illegal methods they go about ending corruption?
Or are they patriots for standing up for our rights against unconstitutional laws?
I personally, think they fall somewhere in between. I think some of the sites they hack are pointless and just so minor in the whole scheme of corruption, and i certainly dont agree with everything they do...but i do agree with some...i mean Sure, I think its good people are trying to make a change and restore our rights and ending the corruption is a great idea in itself.... But the government has already made claims like "The group of Anonymous is strong enough to shut down the whole power grid"... Now Anonymous denies that they can do that and also say that they wouldnt want to, millions are on life support, they wouldnt want to end their lives ect ect.
Anyways, hypothetical, say something would happen..weather the power grid goes out, or the internet shuts down for a day or cell phones dont work for a day... anything like that, Anonymous would be the first accused.... and the point isnt weather Anonymous did the attack or if its the government itself that does the attack.... the attack itself would probably be enough to PASS bills like SOPA for 'our protection' so 'this doesnt happen again'.
I think they want to do alot of good for the people, and their message is good but the ways the are going about business could be the very reason more unconstitutional acts are passed.
whats your opinion terrorists or freedom fighters?
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Well no problem if they keep doing whet they do now. It's true they could do much more I guess, but they need limits and responsability. They wanna do the 'good things' so they probably know the consequences of their acts and they know they shouldn't pass some limits ...
So in my view they ain't bad for the moment
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Anonymous doesn't necessarily "hack" anything. They are a bunch of kids with scripts that attack vulnerable websites. The entire group is a joke. They act like they are doing good, but in reality, they''re not. Nothing they have done has changed anything.
They pledged to take down facebook, and guess what didn't happen? Because they couldn't. Any site with half decent security is protected from those kids.
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Anonymous doesn't necessarily "hack" anything. They are a bunch of kids with scripts that attack vulnerable websites. The entire group is a joke. They act like they are doing good, but in reality, they''re not. Nothing they have done has changed anything.
They pledged to take down facebook, and guess what didn't happen? Because they couldn't. Any site with half decent security is protected from those kids.
Yeah, so they not bad, they are useless :D
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I don't understand any of it, seems pretty pointless to me. I first heard about them when they did the stuff to Sony. My first impression was that they were a bunch of bored people. *shrug* I just categorize them with imgur, reddit, 4chan and all the other useless shit on the internet.
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lulzsec on the other hand....
lulzsec is even worse because they just wanted to be assholes as far as I'm concerned. They didn't have a false identity of "protector of the internet", which Anonymous seems to think they are. Also, aren't they disbanded now? I thought I heard something about that. Either way, the world would be a better place without those idiots who think they are cool because they can use scripts to take down sites.
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They pledged to take down facebook, and guess what didn't happen? Because they couldn't. Any site with half decent security is protected from those kids.
ummm..idk about facebook, but , they hack the FBI site regularly, think the holiday is called Fuck FBI Friday.... pretty sure most the sites they hack into that make headline news have pretty good security measures as well... And i agree, nothing has been changed directly cuz of them, but disagree that they are 'useless' with the publicity and arrests being made around the world, its obvious they are seen as some kind of threat... and to my knowledge, they are still around.
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disagree that they are 'useless' with the publicity and arrests being made around the world, its obvious they are seen as some kind of threat... and to my knowledge, they are still around.
So, because they get arrested that makes them useful? I guess... free prison labor, at the expense of the taxpayers. You must be a glass half full kinda guy.
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....sure
edit: k, my only point is, if they were truly useless, they wouldnt make headline news.... useless to me, would be more or less them being in the background and people going "oh, whos that?"
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ummm..idk about facebook, but , they hack the FBI site regularly, think the holiday is called Fuck FBI Friday.... pretty sure most the sites they hack into that make headline news have pretty good security measures as well... And i agree, nothing has been changed directly cuz of them, but disagree that they are 'useless' with the publicity and arrests being made around the world, its obvious they are seen as some kind of threat... and to my knowledge, they are still around.
Again, stop saying "hack". They don't hack anything. They use pre-made scripts to take down sites or gain unsecure databases. They don't do any hacking. They never hacked the FBI, they just took the site down. They never will hack the FBI. Also, them being arrested has nothing to do with how useful they are. I guess people who smoke pot are super important because they get arrested for possession, right? /sarcasm.
What good has Anonymous done? Cool, they can take down the Bank of America website for a few hours, what does that achieve? Nothing. Life goes on as if it never happened. These wannabe "internet heroes" are nothing but a bunch of jokes who have nothing better to do in their lives.
They make headline news because the media loves to blow stuff out of proportion. Why do celebrities going shopping make the news? Is that important as well?
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It's cool when me and Killa see eye to eye. Especially when he's more articulate than I am :)
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I guess people who smoke pot are super important because they get arrested for possession, right? /sarcasm.
lol, k good point. let me rephrase. The reason i dont think they are 'useless' is because weather they succeed or not by what they do, at least they tried to stop the bull.... and they are 'recognized' for what they did... if more people stood up against the bull, less redic laws would pass. my 2cents.
and uhh, sorry for saying hacking, guess i dont kno the methods they go about business
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"Bull" is a matter of perspective. People standing up for what they believe in will just cause more conflict because people believe differently and some couldn't care less about some topics. I guess it's a good thing but there's so many things to change in the world and so little will to even fight 1 small subject. Taking down a website won't change anything and I personally don't see it as a motivator to get inspired.
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lol, k good point. let me rephrase. The reason i dont think they are 'useless' is because weather they succeed or not by what they do, at least they tried to stop the bull.... and they are 'recognized' for what they did... if more people stood up against the bull, less redic laws would pass. my 2cents.
and uhh, sorry for saying hacking, guess i dont kno the methods they go about business
Yes, while I guess it can be considered good to protest companies such as Bank of America, they are going about it in the wrong way. If they want to make those companies look bad, they shouldn't be doing something illegal that makes themselves look bad as well. It's counter productive. the only thing they are doing is giving these companies more reasons to not care about customers.
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Yes, while I guess it can be considered good to protest companies such as Bank of America, they are going about it in the wrong way. If they want to make those companies look bad, they shouldn't be doing something illegal that makes themselves look bad as well. It's counter productive. the only thing they are doing is giving these companies more reasons to not care about customers.
i agree with that... but what way should people go about it? havent the legal ways been tried in the past?
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A few weeks ago they released their os on hacker news ;)
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I like anonymous a lot.
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I like anonymous a lot.
Can't tell if serious......
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I never lie.
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I never lie.
ah, Now I know you're not serious. :P
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No, I genuinely enjoy the existence of Anonymous. Fighting the good fight :)
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No, I genuinely enjoy the existence of Anonymous. Fighting the good fight :)
Still don't believe you due to your lack of explanation. You're gonna have to do better than that. :P
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They help people that need help, troll people who need to be trolled, etc.
I'm also a huge fan of Assange/wikileaks so maybe that could explain it better. I hate the government and find it amusing when Anonymous fucks with them. Or when they do good stuff like fucking with that cartel and stuff.
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They help people that need help
Care to list a few since you seem to follow them? My skeptical side questions how they could possibly help people and do good.
Wikileaks is something entirely different and while I don't support him, I don't think what he does is ultimately wrong. I'm neutral on it.
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I don't follow them at all, I haven't been on 4chan in years or reddit in months. When I'm really bored I'll hop on 420chan and lurk for a while but I don't have any idea what they've been up to as of late. I remember reading about that anon some cartel was holding and they threatened to release names of members of the cartel if they didn't let him go. Eventually he was released by the cartel, who threatened them into not releasing any names. Not sure how much of that story is true but I heard lots of people talking about it a few months ago.
Julian Assange > Anon, though
Wikileaks is amazing. If governments weren't so corrupt and packed full of bullshit wikileaks wouldn't be seen as a threat.
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I don't follow them at all, I haven't been on 4chan in years or reddit in months. When I'm really bored I'll hop on 420chan and lurk for a while but I don't have any idea what they've been up to as of late. I remember reading about that anon some cartel was holding and they threatened to release names of members of the cartel if they didn't let him go. Eventually he was released by the cartel, who threatened them into not releasing any names. Not sure how much of that story is true but I heard lots of people talking about it a few months ago.
Julian Assange > Anon, though
Wikileaks is amazing. If governments weren't so corrupt and packed full of bullshit wikileaks wouldn't be seen as a threat.
wikileaks is nothing like anonymous. Not comparable in the slightest. And Anonymous always backs out of their threats when they realize they can't do shit. The cartels is a great example. They said they were going after the cartels, a "member" is supposedly captured and guess what they never did? If you guess attack the cartels you would be correct. They're nothing but jokes that want to feel important but really aren't.
Wikileaks actually released embarrassing shit, Anonymous takes down a website for a little bit and tries to act like they are important.
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Wow, I guess the world is such a better place now.
/sarcasm
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no, but justice was necessary there. and anon allowed that justice.
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A few good deeds doesn't outweigh hundreds of bad ones.
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examples of bad ones? besides yelling DUMBLEDORE DIES at the harry potter book release
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examples of bad ones? besides yelling DUMBLEDORE DIES at the harry potter book release
Taking down government and corporate websites. This is what they mainly do, and it is not productive at all.
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who said that was a bad thing? as archi said before, if the governments of todays world weren't corrupt and packed full of shit eaters, then why would wikileaks be seen as such a threat? also, you said before that anon doesn't do shit, yet you say here they take down government and corporate websites. not really sure how your argument lines up :-x
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who said that was a bad thing? as archi said before, if the governments of todays world weren't corrupt and packed full of shit eaters, then why would wikileaks be seen as such a threat? also, you said before that anon doesn't do shit, yet you say here they take down government and corporate websites. not really sure how your argument lines up :-x
because taking down a site for an hour or two doesn't do shit. It's useless, just like the group itself. They're just adding to the problem. Did you not read any of my posts? I thought I made my point pretty obvious.
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I am pro and contre Anonymous, but I'm scared of Killaman so let's say Anonymous is bad lolz.
No really I believe you guys are talking too hardcore about this.
You're supposed to give yr opinion, no true or false, so chill ou.
I feel like a negative atmosphere :o
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pic related
(https://dl-web.dropbox.com/get/Photos/tumblr_ln6c4gpiDb1qlcz3ho1_500.gif?w=379ceaf6)
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Killaman is obviously on drugs. Taking down a company website completely cripples the company and in 3 days flat they will go bankrupt and anon wins.
/sarcasm
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killa after reading through some of this ive noticed some things you said that arent true. Anon never vowed to take down facebook. They've actually stated that they have no reason to take down facebook because thats one of the main ways many of anon get info from them. They are nowhere near useless as they have started protests around the world. And some of the information they have released has actually made some corrupt ceos resign. I support these guys 100% and believe they are the start to fixing this broken world. They are getting quite a big following and their priorities are straight. The fact that they are called terrorists is beside me. Who are they terrorizing? the only thing the government did by naming them terrorists is showing they fear anon. You really are blind to the problems of this world if you think anon is useless...
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killa after reading through some of this ive noticed some things you said that arent true. Anon never vowed to take down facebook. They've actually stated that they have no reason to take down facebook because thats one of the main ways many of anon get info from them. They are nowhere near useless as they have started protests around the world. And some of the information they have released has actually made some corrupt ceos resign. I support these guys 100% and believe they are the start to fixing this broken world. They are getting quite a big following and their priorities are straight. The fact that they are called terrorists is beside me. Who are they terrorizing? the only thing the government did by naming them terrorists is showing they fear anon. You really are blind to the problems of this world if you think anon is useless...
What have they done? They take down poorly secured websites for a couple of hours and then it's back to business as usual. It's useless, they're useless. Also, they did say they were going to take down facebook, just like they said they were going after the cartels. They backed down on both.
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again they have not threatened to take down facebook lol. And like i said they have released classified info and gotten corrupt ceos to resign because of the info they have released. Did you read anything i said? lol.
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again they have not threatened to take down facebook lol. And like i said they have released classified info and gotten corrupt ceos to resign because of the info they have released. Did you read anything i said? lol.
What COEs? I'm actually curious. Regardless, doing a few good things doesn't make the bad they do good.
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the one i know of is the ceo of HBGary which is a cyber security firm for a lot of federal government websites and what not. And what bad do they do? Theyre main goal is for "Free Humanity" I dont see any bad in that at all. the point that our government is at you have to destroy it to fix it.
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the one i know of is the ceo of HBGary which is a cyber security firm for a lot of federal government websites and what not. And what bad do they do? Theyre main goal is for "Free Humanity" I dont see any bad in that at all. the point that our government is at you have to destroy it to fix it.
They can't destroy the government. The closest they've come is taking the CIA website offline for a couple of minutes. It's a joke. Also, the PSN attack was stupid. They didn't punish Sony, just the people that wanted to play their PS3s. They're not doing anything that matters. Their intentions might be good, but they way they go about them is useless and makes them look like criminals.
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They can't destroy the government. The closest they've come is taking the CIA website offline for a couple of minutes. It's a joke. Also, the PSN attack was stupid. They didn't punish Sony, just the people that wanted to play their PS3s. They're not doing anything that matters. Their intentions might be good, but they way they go about them is useless and makes them look like criminals.
first off id like to state i really like debating things with you :)
second of all anon has actually rallied protests and has been a huge part of the occupy movement. They are growing very fast and the government is taking notice of them and do fear them. Hence labeling them "terrorists"
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first off id like to state i really like debating things with you :)
second of all anon has actually rallied protests and has been a huge part of the occupy movement. They are growing very fast and the government is taking notice of them and do fear them. Hence labeling them "terrorists"
They've become and annoyance for sure, but nothing that is threatening at all.
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blind patriotism
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They've become and annoyance for sure, but nothing that is threatening at all.
if the government wasnt threatened by them why would they label them as terrorists? Isnt that definition of terrorist? someone that strikes fear into others. If they were just an annoyance wouldnt the government just write them off like they would if it were just 1 person knocking on their door?
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if the government wasnt threatened by them why would they label them as terrorists? Isnt that definition of terrorist? someone that strikes fear into others. If they were just an annoyance wouldnt the government just write them off like they would if it were just 1 person knocking on their door?
They labeld them terrorists as a scare tactic. It doesn't matter what they label them, until Anonymous does anything more than disabling a website for a couple of minutes, they will always be a joke when it comes to making a difference.
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how do you expect anything to change when you just write off anything that IS trying to make a change as a joke? In my eyes you are the one who has blind hatred for this country because you are not willing to do anything to change it.
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how do you expect anything to change when you just write off anything that IS trying to make a change as a joke? In my eyes you are the one who has blind hatred for this country because you are not willing to do anything to change it.
And you are? what have you done? If they want to change the country, they should do something more effective. It's as simple as that.
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by declaring hacking terriosm they can then invoke the patriot act for surveillance and monitoring the group, the goverment doest fear them, they are giving more power to investigators, and blind patriots hearing they are terriost will support the goverment. just because the goverments stepped up the stakes doesnt mean they fear this group, its more along the lines of the goverment finally taking notice of the group and laughing at the fact they have the power to lable a person a terriost for something as simple as a denial of service attack....
I dont even think the goverment (the us atleast) is overly worried of protests, because 1 in every 5 protester will fuck it up for the rest of them and make the 'movement' a joke. the only way to 'fix' the country is by culling the dickheads fuckwits and killamans
They don't need to label someone a terrorist to use the patriot act.
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makes it easier to justify it later though
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by declaring hacking terriosm they can then invoke the patriot act for surveillance and monitoring the group, the goverment doest fear them, they are giving more power to investigators, and blind patriots hearing they are terriost will support the goverment. just because the goverments stepped up the stakes doesnt mean they fear this group, its more along the lines of the goverment finally taking notice of the group and laughing at the fact they have the power to lable a person a terriost for something as simple as a denial of service attack....
I dont even think the goverment (the us atleast) is overly worried of protests, because 1 in every 5 protester will fuck it up for the rest of them and make the 'movement' a joke. the only way to 'fix' the country is by culling the dickheads fuckwits and killamans
Personally I find this abuse of the patriot act being as anonymous is in no way shape or form "terrorists"
And you are? what have you done? If they want to change the country, they should do something more effective. It's as simple as that.
I personally have done nothing. But I do follow anonymous and as soon as a protest strikes up in my area you bet your bottom dollar ill be there. Again they are starting up protests and are a huge part of the occupy movement. Im definitely repeating myself here. You should do more research before you make claims about something you clearly dont know much about.
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It's useless, they're useless.
It would be cool to see proof that they've actually done anything, until then, they're a waste of time and a joke.
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It would be cool to see proof that they've actually done anything, until then, they're a waste of time and a joke.
All the protests world wide that have happend because of them? The CEO of HBGary resigning because of all the emails they released? They are making headway and only getting stronger
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Hurrr we are legion hurr we are internet heroes
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All the protests world wide that have happend because of them? The CEO of HBGary resigning because of all the emails they released? They are making headway and only getting stronger
Is there a written statement or video of his resignation saying that it was directly influenced by Anonymous? Perhaps he resigned to retire? Protests can't be proof because they're chaotic and you can't measure the effectiveness, plus how can you know what actually starts them unless you are a part of them from the planning stages?
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Well if you know the thing about anonymous is they all wear the vendetta mask. If you watch videos of these protests everyone in the protest is wearing the vendetta mask. Coincidence? I dont think so. As for the CEO yes he resign directly because of a scandal caused by the release of thousands of emails by anon. Here's a link:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/03/02/951558/-HBGary-CEO-resigns-in-wake-of-ChamberLeaks-scandal-House-Dems-want-investigation (http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/03/02/951558/-HBGary-CEO-resigns-in-wake-of-ChamberLeaks-scandal-House-Dems-want-investigation)
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Aaron Barr's departure as CEO of HBGary Federal represented the latest twist for the company
I didn't see anything where his resignation was directly caused by Anonymous. I don't particularly understand the hate towards the company either, I've not heard of them before.
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They are a security firm. Their job is to keep all of the bad corrupt stuff on government computers safe. The emails that were released brought on a federal investigation of the company and here's a quote released by aaron barr himself:
The chief executive at data security firm HBGary Federal has resigned his job following a high-profile hack staged by online protest group “Anonymous.â€
Aaron Barr, the embattled CEO, made the disclosure yesterday speaking to ThreatPost, an online security blog.
“I need to focus on taking care of my family and rebuilding my reputation,†he reportedly said. “It’s been a challenge to do that and run a company. And, given that I’ve been the focus of much of the bad press, I hope that, by leaving, HBGary and HBGary Federal can get away from some of that. I’m confident they’ll be able to weather this storm.â€
Source: Raw Story (http://s.tt/1d7YY)
pretty self explanatory if you ask me.
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So Anonymous indirectly creates one of the three reasons for him to resign. Now, what does that do? All the corruption and bad things from the company are completely gone?
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So Anonymous indirectly creates one of the three reasons for him to resign. Now, what does that do? All the corruption and bad things from the company are completely gone?
well obviously not but you have to start somewhere. Is there really a way to get rid of all the corruption? Yes anonymous hasnt done anything big yet towards their cause but they are doing SOMETHING and thats more than a lot of people in this world can say. They are building and constantly working towards revolution and I truly believe it will happen and support them 100% and plan to start taking action myself as much as i can. Id be a hypocrite if i didnt.
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I truly believe it will happen and support them 100% and plan to start taking action myself as much as i can. Id be a hypocrite if i didnt.
Yes, you would. Where as I would be a regular bystander :) Too many problems to fix, too many different priorities to have a passion and forward a cause. Too much unorganized desire for improvement. I'd rather live my life than spend my time trying to fix something that is broken in so many ways.
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Yes, you would. Where as I would be a regular bystander :) Too many problems to fix, too many different priorities to have a passion and forward a cause. Too much unorganized desire for improvement. I'd rather live my life than spend my time trying to fix something that is broken in so many ways.
touche
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for you guys that say anonymous hasn't done anything to help the cause. I just read that in Anaheim the Occupy movement stormed a police station and there have been massive protests because of 2 police shootings over the course of the weekend. Multiple children were shot and mauled by a police k9 unit as well. Pretty sickening if you ask me
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for you guys that say anonymous hasn't done anything to help the cause. I just read that in Anaheim the Occupy movement stormed a police station and there have been massive protests because of 2 police shootings over the course of the weekend. Multiple children were shot and mauled by a police k9 unit as well. Pretty sickening if you ask me
I find the fact that the public would do such a protest over 1 wrongful killing sickening. The guy was a known gang member. That doesn't excuse the fact he was killed while unarmed, but it's hardly something to storm a police station for. The area has huge gang problems and the public comes together to protest the police? Are you fucking serious? Gangs kill people all the time, nobody cares, police accidentally kill 1 person everyone is up in arms over it. If they care about people getting killed protest the fucking gangs instead of the police where 1 officer happened to have a lapse in judgement.
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I find the fact that the public would do such a protest over 1 wrongful killing sickening. The guy was a known gang member. That doesn't excuse the fact he was killed while unarmed, but it's hardly something to storm a police station for. The area has huge gang problems and the public comes together to protest the police? Are you fucking serious? Gangs kill people all the time, nobody cares, police accidentally kill 1 person everyone is up in arms over it. If they care about people getting killed protest the fucking gangs instead of the police where 1 officer happened to have a lapse in judgement.
are you serious? First of all there were 2 wrongful shootings. Second of hall multiple children were shot as well as mauled by a k9 unit. That is sickening. Not to mention all of the harmful force police have been using at protests. Guess what. Every American has the RIGHT to protest. That is in the constitution. I read somewhere that police handcuffed a womens hands behind her back and proceeded to mace her. It is absolutely insane.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WmEHcOc0Sys[/youtube]
that marine explains it better than me.
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why ppl dont go protest in siria?
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are you serious? First of all there were 2 wrongful shootings. Second of hall multiple children were shot as well as mauled by a k9 unit. That is sickening. Not to mention all of the harmful force police have been using at protests. Guess what. Every American has the RIGHT to protest. That is in the constitution. I read somewhere that police handcuffed a womens hands behind her back and proceeded to mace her. It is absolutely insane.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WmEHcOc0Sys[/youtube]
that marine explains it better than me.
Storming a police station isn't covered by your right to assembly. It's private property. Also, never heard of a second killing. Also, the k9 was said to have gotten loose. People are blowing this out of proportion.
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No it isnt covered. But with the way our government is doing things this isnt going to be able to be handled in a way where we just sit down and talk things out. Force is going to be necessary. Our government is at the point where it can't be fixed. It needs to be torn down and rebuilt from the ground up.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VR67yRQdOlo&feature=relmfu[/youtube]
you can clearly see in that video the police releasing the dog on people.
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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WmEHcOc0Sys[/youtube]
that marine explains it better than me.
Yeah, that mofo is just great, I love him. And what was best in that movie - contrast between him, and all those small, funny faced, scared policemen. LOL.
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police stations aren't private property, they run with our money, but go tell this to the cops :P
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Yes, because it's public property, you are allowed to storm it.
In other news, it's okay to steal a police car because that is also run with our money.
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No it isnt covered. But with the way our government is doing things this isnt going to be able to be handled in a way where we just sit down and talk things out. Force is going to be necessary. Our government is at the point where it can't be fixed. It needs to be torn down and rebuilt from the ground up.
LMAO. Even you are blowing this out of proportion. The guy responsible for the shooting is on suspension and an investigation is under way. What the fuck more do you want? Take him to the town square and burn him in front of a crowd? Jesus Christ. Some people will go way out of their way to try to say our government is bad. Yeah, the entire situation has been handled poorly by law enforcement, but have you ever considered that they have never handled anything like this before? But nah, fuck it, lets tear the whole country down over this incident. Might as well let the local gangs protect the citizen since the government is so evil and bad, right?
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Yes, because it's public property, you are allowed to storm it.
In other news, it's okay to steal a police car because that is also run with our money.
run with my money but isn't MINE, but its to serve the population.
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I cannot not believe that you are sticking up for law enforcement here. YOU CANNOT CONTROL UNVIOLENT PEOPLE WITH VIOLENCE. It is completely legal to protest.
Also just to prove to you that the cops were completely in the wrong here they went door to door after the incident was over offering money to people to buy cell phone videos so it wouldn't get out.
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I cannot not believe that you are sticking up for law enforcement here. YOU CANNOT CONTROL UNVIOLENT PEOPLE WITH VIOLENCE. It is completely legal to protest.
Also just to prove to you that the cops were completely in the wrong here they went door to door after the incident was over offering money to people to buy cell phone videos so it wouldn't get out.
I never said the police weren't in the wrong. I believe I even said that they handles the situation poorly. Yes, as a matter of fact I did say that. My main point is that this whole thing is being blown out of proportion.
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It is not being blown out of proportion at all. This is a very serious issue. Weather you want it to or not change is coming and not just in this country but around the world. Governments are trying to take us over and control us and I at least will fight to not let that happen.
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It is completely legal to protest.
once the authorities find the protest "dangerous", bye bye protest
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Big fuckin deal, few more people dead in the world. Tons die every day, are you going to protest every individuals wrongful death? Nah, only focus on the ones the media decide to feed you. Or you could be like me and ignore all that bullshit that has no effect on your daily life. Ignore the news, nothing you can do to change what's going on anyway. If you think that's bullshit and want to get involved, do something realistic in your local community instead of donating a few bucks to some cause or joining that occupy crap whatever the fuck it is.
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I honestly completely disagree with your way of looking at things. Just because these things arent affecting my life now doesnt mean in the long run they wont. I won't just sit back and watch as things unfold. I definitely don't watch the news but I do like to keep up with what is happening and I am going to contribute in every way possible to make a change.
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Nothing Anonymous has done has improved or degraded my life. Nothing those stupid occupy protests have done has improved or degraded my life. Why should I give a crap about them when they're wasting their time? Yea, it's incredibly selfish of me to think like that but that's how the world works. There's so many causes that need help and support. It's great to be passionate about something but stop and think; are you really making a difference? No.
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It is not being blown out of proportion at all. This is a very serious issue. Weather you want it to or not change is coming and not just in this country but around the world. Governments are trying to take us over and control us and I at least will fight to not let that happen.
Ok, you can hold onto that delusion all you want. Until I actually have any of my freedoms taken away, I'm not going to hop aboard the "government wants to control us" train. I'm not going to be up in arms over everything the media blows out of proportion, which is everything.
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Ok, you can hold onto that delusion all you want. Until I actually have any of my freedoms taken away, I'm not going to hop aboard the "government wants to control us" train. I'm not going to be up in arms over everything the media blows out of proportion, which is everything.
Well unlike you I'm not blind to what is happening around the world. So I'll fight to prevent it while you sit around and wait for it to happen.
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Well unlike you I'm not blind to what is happening around the world. So I'll fight to prevent it while you sit around and wait for it to happen.
I would ask for proof but I know better from the last topic we had this discussion in. You can try to fight against something that isn't there, be my guest. It doesn't affect my life any. I've lost no freedoms stated in the constitution, yet the government is trying to control us. Sorry, but it doesn't add up.
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My beliefs fall somewhere between Max and Nate:
I don't pay attention to the media, but I agree that this country's wrongs cannot be made right easily. That's why I don't give a fuck. If you people want to stay here and accept our government's actions I won't try to convince you otherwise. Maybe that makes me selfish, but people like Killa refuse to believe that our government has stopped caring about its citizens. I'm getting the fuck out.
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My beliefs fall somewhere between Max and Nate:
I don't pay attention to the media, but I agree that this country's wrongs cannot be made right easily. That's why I don't give a fuck. If you people want to stay here and accept our government's actions I won't try to convince you otherwise. Maybe that makes me selfish, but people like Killa refuse to believe that our government has stopped caring about its citizens. I'm getting the fuck out.
Yup. It's stopped caring. That's why they give us free money when we retire. They also give free healthcare to those that are disabled and so on. Cheap student loans are also extremely selfish of them. So much so that they lose a ton of money because they will forget student loan debts after a certain amount of years. But sure, they don't care, not at all. I'm not sure what you consider "caring" Yeah the U.S. doesn't have all the social programs that other countries do, but that's due to our system of government. We have the constitution to abide by. I'm glad you want to go to a "better" country. You'll soon find out that every country has its problems, you're just so blinded by your hatred for the U.S. than you don't want to see it.
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Yup. It's stopped caring. That's why they give us free money when we retire. They also give free healthcare to those that are disabled and so on. Cheap student loans are also extremely selfish of them. So much so that they lose a ton of money because they will forget student loan debts after a certain amount of years. But sure, they don't care, not at all. I'm not sure what you consider "caring" Yeah the U.S. doesn't have all the social programs that other countries do, but that's due to our system of government. We have the constitution to abide by. I'm glad you want to go to a "better" country. You'll soon find out that every country has its problems, you're just so blinded by your hatred for the U.S. than you don't want to see it.
I was gonna give up on this but again with the hatred for the us thing. I dont hate my country I LOVE my country which is exactly why I want to fight for change. Like I've said before I'm enlisted in the Marines. Would someone who hates their country enlist in the military to fight for it? I think not. You also realize that whole free money for retirement isn't going to last very long right? You may pay a social security tax now but I will bet that you won't see one cent of that after you retire. Also I hope they lose money from student loans because the whole fact that you have to pay that much money to get an education is absolutely ridiculous. Having a degree means nothing anymore these days. Sure you have a better chance than those who don't have one but all it is now is a piece of paper. So you rack up this huge debt and for what, a better chance at getting a job? That's not how it should be. I'm done after this because I'm getting sick and tired of beating a dead horse.
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I'm with Max 100% on everything except loving this country. I don't love or hate this country, it is what it is. Freedom is a double edged sword IMO. It wouldn't be bad if it weren't for the freedom of stupidity and human nature.
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I was gonna give up on this but again with the hatred for the us thing. I dont hate my country I LOVE my country which is exactly why I want to fight for change. Like I've said before I'm enlisted in the Marines. Would someone who hates their country enlist in the military to fight for it? I think not. You also realize that whole free money for retirement isn't going to last very long right? You may pay a social security tax now but I will bet that you won't see one cent of that after you retire. Also I hope they lose money from student loans because the whole fact that you have to pay that much money to get an education is absolutely ridiculous. Having a degree means nothing anymore these days. Sure you have a better chance than those who don't have one but all it is now is a piece of paper. So you rack up this huge debt and for what, a better chance at getting a job? That's not how it should be. I'm done after this because I'm getting sick and tired of beating a dead horse.
Why did you assume I was talking to you even though I quoted Archi? I wasn't talking to you. I do find it strange that you are enlisting in the Marines when you said the government is so bad it needs to be torn down and rebuilt. You are aware who you take your orders from, right? Hint: It's the government.
Also, the price of college isn't the government's fault, it's the colleges'. Not to mention the government IS losing money on student loans and they know it, yet people still think they're not looking out for the citizens. The price of college is a different debate though, I was just pointing out the things the government does for the citizens. Also, while it is true that social security is operating at a loss now, they still have more than enough funds to carry on for a while, hopefully long enough for us to see some reform.