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America's Army => General Chat => Topic started by: Vanoke on Wednesday, August 20, 2014, 13:45:45 PM
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Lost topic mergendice
Hi Spanky i hope you can explain my topic to Elize if it has potential, i will hear.
Its to make a price for the time Eliz probably needs to work for .
1 map that must be chosen by the players that is worthy for.
greating Vanoke
p.s : Playing assist and converted coop maps offline, dussent work game is freezing ore can`t run.
Do i miss sumthing?
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p.s : Playing assist and converted coop maps offline, dussent work game is freezing ore can`t run.
Do i miss sumthing?
Yes. You missed the part, where this version of AA still doesn't have working AI. It's not all about the map.
I'm not saying it would be impossible to add AI to this version, but someone would definitely have to do it so just converting a map wont do the trick, and I don't know if ELiZ would like to spend so much time and effort to port AI to this version of AA.
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I did get the info that whit ArmyOps.exe in assist root you can play the maps offline but that is not working.
Yes. You missed the part, where this version of AA still doesn't have working AI. It's not all about the map.
I'm not saying it would be impossible to add AI to this version, but someone would definitely have to do it so just converting a map wont do the trick, and I don't know if ELiZ would like to spend so much time and effort to port AI to this version of AA.
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Like myself and Vanoke say, we can invest some money to Eliz for his efforts in porting AI to this version, I do believe not just us two who will do it.
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I renamed the thread to make things more clear.
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Anser to Vilkas ones a ...... now starting to get a nice time whit you :cool:
It calls merchandise :makemyday: :) :) that means whit a lot participants an appropriate amount of money to make
things possible. You talk like we take all costs on us OOPS. I do have a wife she needs to be feeded to.
(https://aao25.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimagizer.imageshack.us%2Fv2%2F1024x768q90%2F594%2Fangrymamai0.jpg&hash=e29ea47db6ab98e77c8cc46af9c839fd) (https://imageshack.com/i/giangrymamai0j)
Like myself and Vanoke say, we can invest some money to Eliz for his efforts in porting AI to this version, I do believe not just us two who will do it.
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Are you meaning merchandise?
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Are you meaning merchandise?
If that's what you call ;)
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Like I said in the last topic. The AI and coop maps in 2.8 were pretty forgettable imo. Time spent on that would be better used elsewhere.
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At this time I will not do any work on adding AI to 25Assist
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People who like coop back in the day liked it because they could go 2000-0 without ever being close to being defeted. The bots were terrible, the vehicles were badly implemented and the general feel of the maps, snakeplain and whatnot was just terrible.
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By the way, how about porting snakeplain, in PvP mode, intead of coop.
I see it like that: Defense is deployed in central camp. They have rockets, snipers, and lot of weapons all around the camp.
Assault is parachuted randomly somewere behind hills.
If there are lot of people. Defense will deploy snipers team in random spot.
Of course map should be changed, there should be more covers, more huts all aroud the map.
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People who like coop back in the day liked it because they could go 2000-0 without ever being close to being defeted. The bots were terrible, the vehicles were badly implemented and the general feel of the maps, snakeplain and whatnot was just terrible.
It was fun :) . And yeah, vehicles were quite bugged, but to be honest i remember a lot of people driving humvees @ 50miles on Snakeplain, either ending up flying down from a ravine or even getting stuck in the terrain at a 30? degrees angle.
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To be fair snakes plain, and interdiction AI were fun when not many players were online.
Id defo like to play those again, if it were to be implemented
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We can port Snakeplain with Assault/Defence quite easily if there's enough interest in it.
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Its an idear. that we can puth in our pocket for the future. If Assist i hope goes on for a long time.
I will puth a test into this forum, to look what players will spend on a nice map.
Hope people will gif a serius reacton a game in the shop is i think around 30 till 60 euro so look ad this game movies and they judge to tactical gaming and graphic image:
Vanoke map 1 15,euro
map 2 25 euro
1 - >>>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuhtnwnIuEk (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CuhtnwnIuEk)
2 - >>> this map is whit bots but whitout it and 50 slots you get players back!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBCvdaRFsRI (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBCvdaRFsRI)
At this time I will not do any work on adding AI to 25Assist
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Vanoke brings up a point that I've had for quite a while. Since AA was made over 10 years ago and hardware/Internet has changed so much since then... I think it would be great to bump player slots up from 26 to 32 or even higher. It's EASILY done in the editor and all the maps could be changed in a couple hours or less. The only issue is, how to balance the teams out when adding new player slots.
Before anyone says, 32 slots will not lag out the engine. UT2004 allowed 32 slots default. I feel we could maybe even do 34 or 36 but it's something that needs to be tested on a map-per-map basis.
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I would be happy if border gets more slots. ........And a ladder!
Negative effect is you suck other game maps empty.
I wood say gif not the populair maps more slots, than you make the adder maps in game more intresting.
Vanoke brings up a point that I've had for quite a while. Since AA was made over 10 years ago and hardware/Internet has changed so much since then... I think it would be great to bump player slots up from 26 to 32 or even higher. It's EASILY done in the editor and all the maps could be changed in a couple hours or less. The only issue is, how to balance the teams out when adding new player slots.
Before anyone says, 32 slots will not lag out the engine. UT2004 allowed 32 slots default. I feel we could maybe even do 34 or 36 but it's something that needs to be tested on a map-per-map basis.
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We can port Snakeplain with Assault/Defence quite easily if there's enough interest in it.
Well Snakeplain wouldn't have the driveable Hummers though.
And I do believe we have a version of Interdiction (only the inside bit) already.
With the map being so huge, without the Hummers, it would only make sense to port the center fortress and I'm not sure if it would be playable that way.
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snakeplain would be cool to come back, but just like aa3 map it wont be played so wouldn't be worth your guys time investing to get it up just for a couple people
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Exemple what would you have chosen to puth into the Assist game Snakeplain ore FLC Assault .
I know what is better for the game. FLC Assault is not ad all attractieve .better game maps and more maps makes people stay.
snakeplain would be cool to come back, but just like aa3 map it wont be played so wouldn't be worth your guys time investing to get it up just for a couple people
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At this time I will not do any work on adding AI to 25Assist
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We know Ganje we are looking into the future. And spanky about the slots to 36 i wood try to do River Village good map needs a upgrade, ore Courtyard would be hooah! . and cooperating between clans.
Make a RiverVillage day !!!!! on plan board, and meaby we must make for all nice game maps a day that clan s know it so they go into that map to fill up !!!! :up:
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Yeah Vanoke, maybe convince Spanky to make 36 slot pipeline and hospital... It would be fun to play against 18 main pump campers and todays majority of community will be happy :D
I really wonder why people non stop come up with fckd up ideas of other maps and so on when only 3 maps are being played now.
Try hq raid or swamp raid with 32 slots... you wont fck this up more when you add some nades on hq :down:
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I don't get it either why some people would like more maps while there's only 3 played ... Waste of time for the admins
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I don't get it either why some people would like more maps while there's only 3 played ... Waste of time for the admins
INDEED VERY TRUE
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LIttle game talk.!!
So the words progress or better say something, with better maps you make assist attractive . I think the old not playing public did already understand that assist can have some help they did get possible a little bored only we oldies led this game run , they also stay away because what you say only 3 / 7 maps are constantly played. Is that because these maps are the only good maps . I think yes and no: yes we prove it we are playing only those maps.>>>> and No because if we planning a schedule that atleast 1 server is played with 26 guys with help of clan members that are a little organised in clans every sundays and ore Wednesday evening 24 /27 august its Bunker Crisis / s water treatment day 31 / 3 august, sept. its AA3 stronghold / Dusk day 7 /10 september Mountain ambuse / Steamroller day and so on.
But i do understand if you puth FLC Assault ore simulair maps i will not come anymore those are maps are after 3 times very bored.
I am happy that my map is well played Border in SF and in Classic becose we quip it alive. other clans keep there maps populair . We had a player GeorgeMac in our clan that likes Radio Tower very much but only whit our help it did get a little populair becose we helpt him on monday its Radio tower time / Now we have whit GcC clan Classic Border on monday. Now there is a guy wind danser he loves Radio Tower and he needs players (A clan that like Radio Tower ) if that map is not played he will go. and you don t see him anymore.
There is nothing wrong to cut out some bad maps and place new better maps to make Assist populair under the young and and old aa publiek, but if we all stay on our map not must will change. And clans can make a diffrent , they have contact to ther members .
About the slots in game i did talk to rais the slots of that real big coop map Highland if it hopefuly in the future to assist but that is a wet dream off a lot players that know this map. That spanky understand that this can be interesting for some maps now in assist is i can understand if you play respawn you get a little the same effect and that was populair in the 2.8.5 game time GCS clan was constant FULL.
If the Border gets 36 players and the rest not i know what happend it get more attractive.
Maby new players stay because the fun, and action. If all maps have it you can say all maps get more interesting. you only need to talk about all maps must be played ( only FLC Assault Brrrrrr)
Greetings Vanoke
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Vanoke brings up a point that I've had for quite a while. Since AA was made over 10 years ago and hardware/Internet has changed so much since then... I think it would be great to bump player slots up from 26 to 32 or even higher. It's EASILY done in the editor and all the maps could be changed in a couple hours or less. The only issue is, how to balance the teams out when adding new player slots.
Before anyone says, 32 slots will not lag out the engine. UT2004 allowed 32 slots default. I feel we could maybe even do 34 or 36 but it's something that needs to be tested on a map-per-map basis.
I personally think 26 is too big.
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Still dont change the fact that something is seriously fucked up with coding in AA which makes all the big servers lag like hell, despite what hardware or internet you're on, This is what has lead up to people actually beliving that others peoples ping effect them in servers,
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i would do the opposite. make playerslots smaller, more crowded servers, maybe more maps are played.
as someone stated already, pipeline is unplayable with 26 slots. ass team has no chance to get in the building and gets rushed all the time, then players leave the server.
most of the maps are not construed for more than 20 slots. even hospital is no fun with all these 203's flying around...
smaller servers would even help new players to get in the game, etc etc
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If it's a problem with the map then we can add another door or something into the building, perhaps the garage. But really, there's 5 entrances on Pipeline. 13 people on a team can't get through 5 entrances? That's not even 3 per door.
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i would do the opposite. make playerslots smaller, more crowded servers, maybe more maps are played.
as someone stated already, pipeline is unplayable with 26 slots. ass team has no chance to get in the building and gets rushed all the time, then players leave the server.
most of the maps are not construed for more than 20 slots. even hospital is no fun with all these 203's flying around...
smaller servers would even help new players to get in the game, etc etc
I've seen Assault demolish Defense on Pipeline on a full server.
It all depends on the teams, really.
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i would do the opposite. make playerslots smaller, more crowded servers, maybe more maps are played.
as someone stated already, pipeline is unplayable with 26 slots. ass team has no chance to get in the building and gets rushed all the time, then players leave the server.
most of the maps are not construed for more than 20 slots. even hospital is no fun with all these 203's flying around...
smaller servers would even help new players to get in the game, etc etc
i tend to agree with this personally. It's good reasoning. I don't know how acceptable it will be to do such a thing though
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i would do the opposite. make playerslots smaller, more crowded servers, maybe more maps are played.
as someone stated already, pipeline is unplayable with 26 slots. ass team has no chance to get in the building and gets rushed all the time, then players leave the server.
most of the maps are not construed for more than 20 slots. even hospital is no fun with all these 203's flying around...
smaller servers would even help new players to get in the game, etc etc
Not true at all. Pipeline is the easiest map to play assault on, it's just that people are retarded. You need 2 things. Pressure on Main entrance, and cover north side entrance and north outside. I could take main and breach it with 3 people. Once inside main entrance you can sit whereever you want, I'll still breach it.
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Maap pipeline has already more doors to go in and this map is more beatifull than that normal pipel. And about to make more slots if people are aganst ore for it . Meaby you can ask the clans that play ther map. For me i wood be happy whit more slots border can have it. 82 clan ask for pipel. Extraction ask merlin Ht / Igc for hospital. For the rest it depence hou big the map is ore playabilety
Adder point is you can self set the slots back to 26 ore 32 ore 36 ore 2 ! if you are server host
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At this time I will not do any work on adding AI to 25Assist
Personally, I'd make it a high priority. I've played allot less since the army shut down the auth servers, not because of assist, but because of no Co-op maps. I enjoyed Snakeplain, Interdiction, ES2 Border, because of the strategy the AI provide - Yes, they can be push overs, sometimes they're real good too! Just would like it 'like' 2.8.5 used to be. I'm sure some here would agree.
Regards,
Gunni
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Gunman, I agree that the idea would be nice. The AI could even be tweaked for more realism and add a bunch more of them too. Porting aside, adding and editing AI in the editor is a pain in the ass, especially if you want to make it realistic. You have to lay down paths and other items that dictate how they behave. It was a good effort by the devs but too little, too late on an engine that's too old.
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Is ther no list from all the people that did make all those coops from AAOTTS ,to ask if they are intrested to help assist . :idea:
its hard to find a link to those guys ! ore i don`t know the right way to look.
I got one her,
http://forum.americasarmy.com/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=2077 (http://forum.americasarmy.com/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=2077)
[email protected]
[email protected]
p.s its not to me that must make the contact becose to less knowledge of subject.
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Ask one more time for game sources.
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Is ther no list from all the people that did make all those coops from AAOTTS ,to ask if they are intrested to help assist . :idea:
its hard to find a link to those guys ! ore i don`t know the right way to look.
I got one her,
http://forum.americasarmy.com/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=2077 (http://forum.americasarmy.com/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=2077)
[email protected]
[email protected]
p.s its not to me that must make the contact becose to less knowledge of subject.
What you don't seem to understand is the fact that the problem right now is the game itself and not the maps. You can port as many coop missions as you wish, but this version of AA doesn't support AI like 2.7+ did.
Adding a functional AI to this version, while possible, would be difficult since we don't have the game source.
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Oke i do understand i stop whit this looking for possebility's
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Ask one more time for game sources.
I sent 3-4 messages after they stopped replying. It's pretty clear that they don't want to do anything.
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but thanks to all for the try
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... Porting aside, adding and editing AI in the editor is a pain in the ass, especially if you want to make it realistic. You have to lay down paths and other items that dictate how they behave. It was a good effort by the devs but too little, too late on an engine that's too old.
It's not about the navigation or engine that's too old - it's about the AA AI code ...
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You can't deny that the engine is old. It's limited. Adding AI code puts extra stress on an engine that's already stressed.
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Not true at all. Pipeline is the easiest map to play assault on, it's just that people are retarded. You need 2 things. Pressure on Main entrance, and cover north side entrance and north outside. I could take main and breach it with 3 people. Once inside main entrance you can sit whereever you want, I'll still breach it.
u can do that, but most players cant. maybe the main problem is, that most of the good players play only 1 side - defence.
of course a good ass team can demolish def on a full server. but how often does that happen - 1/100(0) ? most of the time the player-constellations are in favor of defence and egoistic aspects like fragrate etc. dominate nowadays...
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u can do that, but most players cant. maybe the main problem is, that most of the good players play only 1 side - defence.
of course a good ass team can demolish def on a full server. but how often does that happen - 1/100(0) ? most of the time the player-constellations are in favor of defence and egoistic aspects like fragrate etc. dominate nowadays...
Hammer meets nail. Well said.
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You can't deny that the engine is old. It's limited. Adding AI code puts extra stress on an engine that's already stressed.
True, is old ... but 'limited'..? It depends on what you want to achieve - e.g. each Splinter Cell including the last Blacklist was build on the same engine and look, how different it is. Don't know how much you guys know about the map optimisation, but there is many ways to do it right - sometimes you have to sacrifice something in order to get better performance.
As for AI: AA developers approached this problem in a very different way than Epic, so most of native calls / functionality are disabled or non-existent. Most important, there is no CoverSystem implemented (didn't check the objective support) ... I mean, AA AI is in very basic stage of development - probably (scripted ...) is just for the E3 shows.
Basically, this AI is useless in the gameplay.
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True, is old ... but 'limited'..? It depends on what you want to achieve - e.g. each Splinter Cell including the last Blacklist was build on the same engine and look, how different it is. Don't know how much you guys know about the map optimisation, but there is many ways to do it right - sometimes you have to sacrifice something in order to get better performance.
As for AI: AA developers approached this problem in a very different way than Epic, so most of native calls / functionality are disabled or non-existent. Most important, there is no CoverSystem implemented (didn't check the objective support) ... I mean, AA AI is in very basic stage of development - probably (scripted ...) is just for the E3 shows.
Basically, this AI is useless in the gameplay.
Of course the engine is limited! Why else would they move on to a newer one with newer versions of AA?
Optimsation is just that, optimisation. You can improve preformance, but you can't remove the need for the processor and/or GPU to calculate stuff and with this engine, it's probably impossible to fully optimise features which this engine wasn't built for (i.e maps from AA3).
And you need to understand that adding anything to the game is much harder than it should simply because we don't have the source for the game.
With that said, I don't think that adding a smarter AI than that which the official devs did would be a bad thing, I just think it's more trouble than it's worth.
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Of course the engine is limited! Why else would they move on to a newer one with newer versions of AA?
:) ... because it's easier/cheaper to buy a new engine with bunch of new features, than implement these features in the old one - you missing a point ...
... even AA4 doesn't look better than SC:Blacklist.
Optimsation is just that, optimisation. You can improve preformance, but you can't remove the need for the processor and/or GPU to calculate stuff and with this engine, it's probably impossible to fully optimise features which this engine wasn't built for (i.e maps from AA3).
It's funny you mention CPU/GPU calculation, because the map optimisation is all about ... e.g.
1 test: Make a simple test map, put 10k dynamic lights, run the game and check rendering time (or FPS if you whish).
2 test: Replace all dynamic lights with static, run the game and check rendering time.
3. Now tell me conclusion ... and why ...
And you need to understand that adding anything to the game is much harder than it should simply because we don't have the source for the game.
Well (:)), believe or not but I have 'some' experiences with game development - especially Unreal Engine based games and how hard (or not ...) it is. That said, you don't need the game source to be able modify game behaviour, extend its functionality or implement new features (I'm not talking about native stuff like rendering etc.). All you need is complete Unreal Script source code, good UDE and compiler.
With that said, I don't think that adding a smarter AI than that which the official devs did would be a bad thing, I just think it's more trouble than it's worth.
Hmm ... With good AI you can have a lot of fun ...
e.g.
Put AI on the empty slots on the server and replace it with the new incoming player ...
... or implement new game mode 'Offline practice', so people can play with AI and gain experience.
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Well (:)), believe or not but I have 'some' experiences with game development - especially Unreal Engine based games and how hard (or not ...) it is. That said, you don't need the game source to be able modify game behaviour, extend its functionality or implement new features (I'm not talking about native stuff like rendering etc.). All you need is complete Unreal Script source code, good UDE and compiler.
That's exactly what ELiZ did with the SAI, ported the code right over. We have a good compiler and halfway decent editor.
The door is always open NBD :)
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Pfffffff, Mr. NoBigDeal again spamming the forum, and pretending he know anything about real coding.
Please dude, leave this stuff to Eliz, he knows what he is doing.
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No doubt that ELiZ knows what he's doing but he's just 1 person. Having a collaborative group of people will get more work done.
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Pit, stop being jelious