AAO25.com

Assist => Support => Server Support => Topic started by: [SWISS]Merlin on Friday, January 24, 2014, 12:20:14 PM

Title: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: [SWISS]Merlin on Friday, January 24, 2014, 12:20:14 PM
hi all out there

the server cache size is by default set to 96.
who of you did change that size to another value - and if so, to witch value?

I am asking because this default could also be changed to another value. then it would not be necessary  to change it back after an update is released.

my value is CacheSizeMegs=256

would be nice to have some feedback about that.
thanks
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: Jared on Friday, January 24, 2014, 12:30:47 PM
I would check with your hosting companies, sometimes they charge more when you edited that. At least they day when AA with alive back in the day.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: {G.O.W.}_Grizz on Friday, January 24, 2014, 13:41:35 PM
I changed mine to 512 and it runs good.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: Possessed on Saturday, January 25, 2014, 08:54:53 AM
I guess 128 is more than enough; what counts is the processor speed :P
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: [SWISS]Merlin on Saturday, January 25, 2014, 18:24:52 PM
for the server, for sure it is not the processor speed. with 50 players on my comp, the processors are about 10% of its max.
network and memory are the magic words for aa25..... and the internal things like pb....
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: Possessed on Saturday, January 25, 2014, 18:35:06 PM
not sure but, AA server uses only 1 core just as the game :) I didn't noticed any diference using more than 64 mb(I've messed alot with servers, especially COOP on my own PC lol)
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: [SWISS]Merlin on Saturday, January 25, 2014, 18:55:35 PM
yes, I did hear this always. but my 8 core system to say something different. maybe one server do use one cpu, but more servers do use more cpu's. so it is really not a prob of the cpu's. I mean today's cpu's :D
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: Spanky on Saturday, January 25, 2014, 19:38:47 PM
If you have multiple servers, you'd be best off making sure that only 1 server uses 1 core instead of 2 servers sharing a single core. It's possible to set this in CPU Affinity. Also, set them to high priority.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: [SWISS]Merlin on Saturday, January 25, 2014, 20:13:38 PM
thanks spanky.
but using windows, all done by it self :()
this is not unix, this is real computing :D
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: [SWISS]Merlin on Saturday, January 25, 2014, 20:16:14 PM
and I still have - I will repeat for all - only 10% CPU usage :D
so really, this is not a CPU prob. it's done or not by network or RAM . if ...
but I will close now with that all.

so leave the RAM size like it is, good for beginners.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: Spanky on Saturday, January 25, 2014, 20:23:28 PM
Right, there's not much done on the CPU on the server side of things. Network speed means the most.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: Possessed on Saturday, January 25, 2014, 20:25:54 PM
Right, there's not much done on the CPU on the server side of things. Network speed means the most.
(https://aao25.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fstatic3.wikia.nocookie.net%2F__cb20130816013738%2Fvampirediaries%2Fimages%2F3%2F30%2FFry-can-t-tell-meme-generator-not-sure-if-sarcasm-or-serious-e14739.jpg&hash=72e554e5dcf64e89956b29c9524490ca)
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: Spanky on Saturday, January 25, 2014, 21:29:05 PM
The client is by far more CPU demanding than a server. I'm being serious.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: ELiZ on Saturday, January 25, 2014, 23:44:18 PM
Found this info on more than one random UE2 engine game site:

Code: [Select]
Q: What is the CacheSizeMegs setting & what value should I use for it?

A: This is from the man, Tim Sweeney himself.

CacheSizeMegs does not cache textures, music, models, sounds, code or anything like that. Setting it to a higher value could perhaps even cause problems (if UT reserves this much memory on startup, then you could be wasting a lot of memory that has been reserved for caching only a small amount of data). Keep this value low.

8MB is the recommended maximum size you should set it. Although if you have 128MB RAM + you may want to try larger values (increases performance in some cases). Do not bother using formula's for deciding this value, 4 - 8MB is all that most users need.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: ELiZ on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 02:00:03 AM
I can still add it to the variables that are configurable.
What more is there, tickrate?
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: ELiZ on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 02:37:27 AM
These are the variables and the default value it will have if not configured, I've planned to add to next version
Quote
CacheSizeMegs=96
MaxSpectators=3
MaxAdmins=3
bDeathMessages=True
bPlayersBalanceTeams=True
bAutoBalanceBetweenRounds=True
bNeverAutoBalance=False
bEnableROEKick=True
MinHonor=8
MaxHonor=100

If I add them they will be the same on a server even after a version update.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: Spanky on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 03:07:05 AM
Battletracker bumped up the maximum honor to 110. Does the .ini setting even care about what the auth server sets it as? Isn't it only for refusing an initial connection?
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: ELiZ on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 03:56:00 AM
Battletracker bumped up the maximum honor to 110. Does the .ini setting even care about what the auth server sets it as? Isn't it only for refusing an initial connection?

Good point.
 
this is from 2.8.5, but I'm guessing that it's the same for 2.5

Code: [Select]
Function VerifyHonorRange ()
{
MinHonor=Clamp(MinHonor,1,100);
MaxHonor=Clamp(MaxHonor,9,100);
if (MinHonor > MaxHonor)
{
MinHonor=1;
}
}

Even if set MaxHonor=105, since it's clamped to 100, 100 is that will be used.
A possible explanation is that the values are not used, since from what I can see they are part of the "real" auth functions(ServerAuthorizeUserAuthorizeComplete), and since we have taken over them they are not used.

What do you think, should we use them in "our" auth?




Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: [SWISS]Merlin on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 07:27:07 AM
oh yes, would be nice to select min and max honors in future - for local admins too.
and I would put a variable for

NetServerMaxTickRate=
LanServerMaxTickRate=

MaxClientRate=

MOTDDisplaySeconds=

MaxSpectators=
MaxPlayers=
MaxAdmins=

ConfiguredInternetSpeed=
ConfiguredLanSpeed=


Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: ELiZ on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 07:39:33 AM
Quote
ConfiguredInternetSpeed=
ConfiguredLanSpeed=

Not used on a server is it?
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: ELiZ on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 07:40:53 AM
Quote
NetServerMaxTickRate=
LanServerMaxTickRate=

Surely only one is used, witch one?
Remember that Assist is Walking inbetween...
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: -[unR]BENDAWICH on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 07:43:55 AM
Isnt the tickrate capped @35 by the engine. I havent messed with a server since like 2010 so my memory isnt the best.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: ELiZ on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 07:48:38 AM
MaxClientRate=15000...


Is already regulated with CVARS
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: ELiZ on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 07:50:02 AM
Isnt the tickrate capped @35 by the engine. I havent messed with a server since like 2010 so my memory isnt the best.

Default is 35 anyways... is higher better, or lower?
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: -[unR]BENDAWICH on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 07:58:32 AM
20 used to be the default as far as i know in 2.8.5 but it was always advised to have it set at 35. So having it at the cap is fine (if ofcourse that is the cap) Helps with bullet registry etc, it is essentially the refresh rate.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: [SWISS]Merlin on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 09:01:30 AM
NetServerMaxTickRate
LANServerMaxTickRate

on my server I-IIII I am testing atm those settings.

I have set them to 50 - to see how the impact is. with that value you have a real smooth running system and it looks like you can open doors better, also from a bit farer away. but maybe 50 is to high, guess 40-45 would be the best value, but for sure, not for every server!! so default should be around 35 but with the possibility to change that in a easy way. if you go to high, it starts with lags and freezes.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: Goncalo on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 09:02:57 AM
yes default was 20, now some1 from assist updated it to 35. its 35 on every server wich is good. I think engine cap it at 35, it cant go higher than that
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: [SWISS]Merlin on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 09:13:39 AM
and it is the NetServerMaxTickRate that counts, the LAN one counts only for LAN partys I guess.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: ELiZ on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 09:16:07 AM
and it is the NetServerMaxTickRate that counts, the LAN one counts only for LAN partys I guess.

Don't be so sure, a Assist server is actually running in LAN mode, it only looks like it's running in GLOBAL.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: Goncalo on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 09:18:49 AM
but try to change it about 35 merlin, tickrate is what affects cpu. try it on 50..to see if its working, after updating the server join has a player, and type stat net in console. if you see IN:X x going above 35 means it did change it, if it doesnt, max is 35.

also ive read that this can help a bit KeepAliveTime= default is 0.2, if you change it to 0.4 or 0.6 it may help
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: [SWISS]Merlin on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 09:25:50 AM
yes, this might be true.
I will so some checks today with that values. you can have a look if you like how it does impact.

[SWISS]ClanServer I:
CacheSizeMegs=256
ConfiguredInternetSpeed=10000
ConfiguredLanSpeed=10000
KeepAliveTime=0.4
NetServerMaxTickRate=35
LanServerMaxTickRate=35

Server II:
CacheSizeMegs=512
ConfiguredInternetSpeed=10000
ConfiguredLanSpeed=10000
KeepAliveTime=0.4
NetServerMaxTickRate=35
LanServerMaxTickRate=35

Server III:
CacheSizeMegs=512
ConfiguredInternetSpeed=15000
ConfiguredLanSpeed=15000
KeepAliveTime=0.8
NetServerMaxTickRate=45
LanServerMaxTickRate=45

Server IIII:
CacheSizeMegs=512
ConfiguredInternetSpeed=15000
ConfiguredLanSpeed=15000
KeepAliveTime=1.0
NetServerMaxTickRate=50
LanServerMaxTickRate=50
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: Spanky on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 12:34:07 PM
What do you think, should we use them in "our" auth?
I say no. Players shouldn't be limited to servers by their honor. It's largely a useless metric these days as "new" players can have 60+ honor because they played years ago. It's not like if you set minimum honor to 50 that you'll only get skilled and respectful members in your server. :)
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: [SWISS]Merlin on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 16:22:18 PM
I say yes, because you can - as local admin - select what you want. why was it by dev's to have it?
so let have it back. if it will be taken for some strange reasons, we can switch it off again, right?
yes.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: Possessed on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 16:28:29 PM
Default is 35 anyways... is higher better, or lower?
higher should be better, but increases the CPU/Bandwidth usage; there are tutorials arround (along with MaxClientRate, this limits the max NetSpeed on clients)

"First of all. Higher tickrate does not improve ping. Very common misconception. What it actually does, is to reduce the time between each time the server handles incoming data, and sends out new data. So let me explain it in more complex terms."

http://wiki.unrealadmin.org/Netspeed_Tutorial_(UT) (http://wiki.unrealadmin.org/Netspeed_Tutorial_(UT))
http://www.unrealadmin.org/server_ini_reference/ut2004 (http://www.unrealadmin.org/server_ini_reference/ut2004)
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: [SWISS]Merlin on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 17:14:45 PM
thanks possessed, I did read them.
so for me, and this is practice - not high talking - I will change all server to the value like server III it has.
all good there, no lag or freeze, all happy with that.
maybe I will come back to say --- wasn't that good at all - but I just do it for real, not for paperwork :)
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: Goncalo on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 17:31:04 PM
ive read everywhere that doesnt reduce ping, but the truth is that it does. you can try urself, the diference between 25 tick and 35 tick can be around 10 15 ping difence for me
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: [SWISS]Merlin on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 17:53:24 PM
yes, but no one is thinking about the settings all together. only one by one, yes.
but try to run them all at once. completely different results.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: Spanky on Sunday, January 26, 2014, 22:09:16 PM
I smell mumbo jumbo voodoo.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: [SWISS]Merlin on Saturday, February 01, 2014, 07:44:07 AM
and now let us see this one. 38 players on the servers and this is the result of the usage:
(https://aao25.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg163.imageshack.us%2Fimg163%2F5928%2F179l.png&hash=a7787ce93c88542b2371b0b3c7c98b70) (http://img163.imageshack.us/i/179l.png/)

and these are the current settings:
CacheSizeMegs=512
ConfiguredInternetSpeed=15000
ConfiguredLanSpeed=15000
KeepAliveTime=0.6
NetServerMaxTickRate=45
LanServerMaxTickRate=45
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: Possessed on Saturday, February 01, 2014, 08:43:06 AM
I guess ConfiguredInternetSpeed=15000/ConfiguredLanSpeed=15000 is ClientSide only. you should look at 'MaxClientRate'

"Server Admin Notice
You got an option in your .ini file under [IpDrv.TcpNetDriver] called MaxClientRate. The default value of this is usually 20000, which means, the client can maximum get 20000 bytes *FROM* server per second. By reducing this value, you can actually optimize the server bandwidth. If you are planning on running a 10 player server on a 512/512 kbit sdsl line, you will have 64kbyte(64KB) up/down, so setting MaxClientRate to 64000/10 = 6400 means you will reduce the chance of having packetloss. This setting will also limit the client upload rate, forcing him to keep a netspeed between 2000 and MaxClientRate."

- From what I understood, for a server with 26 slots and leaving around ~10KBs up/down for each player(assuming the server is full, when Not full, I guess the players will have more than ~10KB avaliable), MaxClientrate is set to 260000(/26 = 10000), 260000 is ~ 253KBs.
TickRate 45 is 22.2ms between each tick on the server(while 50 = 20ms & 100 = 10ms).

"Lets have a ping of 60 in DOS to a certain server. This means a packet of data uses 60 milliseconds to go from your superfantastic computer to the crappy tickrate 20 server in Uganda and back. In other words. Now because of the complexity of the net, this doesn't mean it uses 30ms to reach the server, and 30ms to travel back. (Asymmetric routing) Someone else will have to explain why this is so. But lets assume that this is actually the true thing this time. The data DOES use 30ms to travel from your computer to the server, and 30ms to reach your computer again. Let's put in some more numbers. The tickrate! We know that it's 50ms between each tick on server. So let's take worst case. The packet of data we send, uses 30ms to reach server. The server has just completed a tick before the data arrived, so the data has to wait for 50ms. Ok, data has waited 50ms and been processed, and now leaves the server for the client to happily enjoy. This takes another 30ms. So to add it up, the packet used 30+50+30 = 110ms to travel from client to server, be processed on server, and return to client.
Another thing that affects result is your own framerate. Your computer will not handle data while it's busy telling the video card what to show you. A framerate of 100fps means that it's another 1000ms/100 = 10ms between each time it can handle data."

ELiZ? :P
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: [SWISS]Merlin on Saturday, February 01, 2014, 09:16:42 AM
good job Possessed, nice explained. thank you!

I will try with all the settings, like you did write above. and I have the luck to ask over 500 IT professionals at my work, witch kind of setting - in this case - would be the best at all.

so lets find out finally, witch of all those settings will bring the best performance - and in witch case. for me, atm, these settings are the best ever I had. but I will go on with doing more tests for sure.

btw: this is not a super computer, only a little 4 core cpu, 16gb ram, ssd ...cost's about 800$. but for sure more powerful then a hosted virtual machine. the only optimization point I have now is the router, given from my internet provider. maybe I will change that, but I am not sure about the effect (would mean another 300$).
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: WORLDCHANCELLOR on Saturday, March 22, 2014, 15:31:57 PM
It's going on 9 years now since I've learned that increasing cachesizemegs generally degrades performance, and that reducing it is much more likely to increase performance (if you're coming from it being increased). I've had it at '1' for quite some time. The first time I noticed this, it was VERY noticeable, especially coming from cachesizemegs being set to 1024/512, etc.

As for tickrate, we valued this dearly back in the days of intense competition, money tournaments, etc. We were so obsessed by it that there were server companies (like "velocity servers") who had 100-tick servers. The servers were so damn smooth that playing on them was like heaven, sheer bliss. It all made sense in our competition servers, even when we were killed; we always knew exactly 'why' we died, which was great information to have. lol

One thing that I never realized about tickrate all these years, until recently, after I set up one of these assist servers on my PC, was that it actually DID seem to affect the ping, making it lower for everyone. I'm not entirely sure why it did this, but it did. I'm setting up another server now to do further testing on this and other things.
Title: Re: Server - CacheSizeMegs=?
Post by: [SWISS]Merlin on Saturday, March 22, 2014, 16:13:46 PM
great. soon you will meet my config :D