AAO25.com
America's Army => General Chat => Topic started by: iTiZmONk3y on Saturday, July 06, 2013, 17:52:35 PM
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Ok, I want to understand why the new update for 2.5 Assist includes No Honor and No battletracker for Americas Army Mod'd Servers. What is the point? We have been PAYING for this server for a long time. Our server during the middle of the day until evening is almost always full for 4 to 5 hours each day. So why are we all of a sudden left with a Non Honor and Non Tracked server that people now do not join because of that. We have been LOYAL to the game and are fair and active players. If you think it is going to bring in more people I would like someone to name ONE plausible reason why it would do just that. Please fix this, 100 to 200 active players throughout most parts of the day is about all you can ask for a game that is 15 or more years old. So seriously, let the people who PAY for the servers and keep the damn game going get what we want. Thank you. :censored:
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Its your server and your free to do anything you want with it. But don't expect aa25.org to honor or track you! You do not pay aa25.org nor do you have a contract with us.
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Why do you guys really care that much about being tracked or gain points, modded servers never been like that before assist and no1 was crying about that
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Yet another person registering here just to bitch and complain. Don't bother to be helpful, participate in discussions or type a simple thank you for the hundreds of hours Jonny and others have put into this FREE project so you can play.
Quoted from another thread:
You can do whatever you want, including uninstalling Assist.
You're not paying for Assist, there is no contract and thus no right that you have to demand any features. You have no obligation to use it either. Assist was developed and is maintained by people for free and they can do what they want with it.
I think you're forgetting about what it used to be like when Pragmatic was running honor for Americas Army. There was an additional cost and it was easy to report servers for abuse and get servers shutdown or de-authorized. There is no cost now. The only thing Jonny asks is that you don't use mods that unbalance the game or destroy core gameplay. You're welcome to use those mods still but the honor will be disabled through HIS program. Right now, you're getting less harsh rules/consequences and not paying a dime compared to Pragmatic's system.
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We care because we have been loyal to the game. I'm sure if aa25 was the people to go to to get a server we would without any questions asked. Why do you care so much about taking it off? Thats what I want to know, is what is the benefit of doing this besides a few people's whiney complaints about it being UNFAIR, boohoo. Better cpu's than others is unfair i dont see you buying people computers, headphones compared to speakers is unfair i dont see you getting people headphones. So why take it off?
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Its great the work and effort you have put into the game but would be completely useless if there were no players to play. Which is what we are, don't get me wrong i'm happy that the game is still around, and will continue to play either way, you keeping this game alive is much appreciated. I just want a resonable explanation for taking away Honor and Tracker for mod servers. Wether you going to do anything about it is irrelevent, i just want to know why.
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Because mods severely alter the original gameplay that America's Army is known for. Same reason why you could report a server to Pragmatic to get it disabled. The game was built for realism and balanced gameplay. Mods throw that out the window. It's not about doing things because people whine, it's about taking the project in a direction that restores the classic AA that we all loved.
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(https://aao25.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimageshack.us%2Fa%2Fimg17%2F2121%2Fcaqk.jpg&hash=9ba5c991fd1693e256ff4398ee46e60d) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/17/caqk.jpg/)
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Because mods severely alter the original gameplay that America's Army is known for. Same reason why you could report a server to Pragmatic to get it disabled. The game was built for realism and balanced gameplay. Mods throw that out the window. It's not about doing things because people whine, it's about taking the project in a direction that restores the classic AA that we all loved.
Understood Nate,but I think the majority of players don't mind mods now and than to mix up the game play...it's all about balance of game play.....Jonny has done a hell of a job,along with a few other admins to keep this game alive,and it's commended by the community!
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That's perfectly fine. I enjoy mods too. I like fucking around in low gravity or RPG fest or whatever but there's a time and place.
That's the whole reason why mods are discouraged but still allowed. Jonny could add code to Assist that deletes the entire AA installation when you install a mod but instead he decided to just disable tracking. I think that's a very fair compromise.
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I agree a hell of a job, but yes people have adapted to the Mod's. I think it gives you a great chance to try out all the guns offered by the game, and as far as I can tell the game has got to be more popular since the mod servers, and if you want realism, when you join the army, you choose what kind of soldier to become which decides what gun you use. Honestly I enjoy the old guns on insurgent camp but when my team is getting stomped and I need a different gun to help us out i like to be able to do so. Oh and honestly I didn't even know this site was around and now that I do I will be active in conversations and posts, i'm not here just to "bitch".
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Perhaps a better pick-a-weap mod would be a more elegant answer. Having different modes such as rifle, machine gun or explosives to stop people from using a rpg when everybody else is having a pistol match. Then maybe allow 1 or 2 people per team to have an AR or something like that.
The problem with that is that none of us really know how to use UScript very effectively. Disabling tracking is by far more easier, faster and fair across the board than trying to redesign current mods.
I'm glad you'll stick around. I just always find it amazing that nobody seems to have heard of this site despite this being the official website that's been running for a year and a half. Most new users just come here to bitch when they think someone is hacking or when something gets changed in Assist or god forbid, when there's down time.
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Ya I am suprised I haven't heard of it as well, but now that i'm here i'm happy to be here. Like you said maybe a different type of Mod server is needed, one that still has a limit to which type of guns to be used. For example on a 13 slot team, 6 SF guns, 3 Grenade Launchers, 2 Snipers, and 2 Ar/Rpk's. Givin the exeption that snipers can be also the no scope ranger gun incase you dont wish to snipe and are stuck with the last 2 picks..
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I'm glad you'll stick around. I just always find it amazing that nobody seems to have heard of this site despite this being the official website that's been running for a year and a half. Most new users just come here to bitch when they think someone is hacking or when something gets changed in Assist or god forbid, when there's down time.
LOL Truth be known I had downloaded the game and been playing it a while and didn't realize the forums were here till I googled something and one of the search links led to these forums.
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(https://aao25.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg17.imageshack.us%2Fimg17%2F2121%2Fcaqk.jpg&hash=f042dc37a631bda7abfdf36a295e2269) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/17/caqk.jpg/)
are these monkeys acting like this because of all the bad english?
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I don't get it, you can still play with mods, just not tracked, why do you care that much?
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hi to all
now we should just make a step back and watch what will happened. the admins and programmer of this game can do what they want. and I guess, maybe, this can go in a good direction. first of all I did not think that it will, but maybe it is a good way.
let's try it. enjoy and relax. give it a chance. for sure, none of us would like to see this game dead (maybe almost all).
so maybe in the future, when the players are growing (what a nice expression :)) then they will maybe accept the modded servers like they do already, but maybe with half honor counting and not with nothing.
but until then, just go and fight and kill all the cheating noobs.
and enjoy the game!
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I mostly care because I have lost my old account with 60 thousand kills and 95 honor, started my new tracker and now the only American server that plays my favorite map, insurgent camp, doesn't get honored or tracked, there you happy wanted? Anyways I have posted my hopeful alternative solution. So I hope it is taken into consideration. I don't think I will be on much until either my clan desides to take off the mod or aa assist takes off there no honor, no track rule. In all reality I hope that my clan decides to take off the mod but unfortunately my clan leader who pays for most of the server is severly against it. My posting was mostly on his behalf, I appreciate all the replies to try and resolve my issue and not just ask why do I care, or why am I crying about it. Good day
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I don't get it, you can still play with mods, just not tracked, why do you care that much?
Tracking is an important thing of any game I think.
Even when you have a bad k/d rate, it's always funny to see your statistics etc. So when you play on modded server you won't have any 'progression' and it's not cool
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The players base is not dropping as you may all express. Every time I join any server I always meet at least 1 new player who has just joined the game or who has played from the past and they say that they are enjoying with what admins did to assist disabling modded servers tracked. This is one step forward. The noobs now has more chance to kill someone. On the bridge there are less spam nades of course and most of the team secure going past their tower. The only thing that assist needs is to keep moving forward. Admins should make a sticky thread with the option that players could give their opinions for the next assist release, what they would like to see. in the game and every opinion discussed.
What assist is missing is passion. Eliz did a great job and she was close on moving to 2.8 but she didnt have a lot of passion anymore. That's happens to everyone and you can't change it but if we try all to move forward and stop arguing about every little hacker/cheater or what the admins do/did to the assist and we can make this happen. There were lots of threads about lets go lets do it but admins couldnt move forward because they are lack of passion to the game.
Another thing is that assist admins or we could say ''staff'' doesn't have experienced coders to change assist into a better game. There were adverts if anyone is a good coder could help the johny. You are welcome to pm him and you may get a staff position. Admins are welcome to accept the new outcomer if he is willing to do stuff and he is experienced coder.
Some things could change if admins start looking into recruits. They should divide the jobs, Etc nate/spanky could work on the maps, sergio work on domain and so on payments, johny on assist, possed on hacker/cheaters and so on dividing jobs what they have to do. Recruit new people who would maybe would look to work on more stuff such as textures, art and design stuff and so on.
The game is alive until we see 0 people on the servers.
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ELiZ is a Man. :P
I think all spots are already filled up, ofc any help is welcome but I don't think we should share most infos, we have suffered in the past, it's hard to find trustable ppl.
We can't spot all the cheaters alone(btw Sergio is almost in every place lol), so your report is valid, even when it appears to be ignored, the players are the best anti-cheat tool. we reserve the right to ban anyone at any time for w/e reason, but, we can't ban every suspect instantly only based on reports.
speaking of the best AC tool, what if we add something like League of Legends Tribunal.
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/tribunal/ NA
http://euw.leagueoflegends.com/tribunal/ EU West
http://eune.leagueoflegends.com/tribunal/ Eu Nordic & East
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The noobs now has more chance to kill someone.
So not true
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So not true
Its true:)
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Oh come on you have all been stating this: "People choose sf guns and stuff because it's easy to shoot with that scope".
A noob will be able to campp and rpg u without alot of problems, but now only oldschool pro's are back so newbies don't even have a chance with that m16. Dont try to find arguments who aren't true
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Great job Jonny, i see already new (old) people coming in, this update had to be implemented
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speaking of the best AC tool, what if we add something like League of Legends Tribunal.
http://na.leagueoflegends.com/tribunal/ NA
http://euw.leagueoflegends.com/tribunal/ EU West
http://eune.leagueoflegends.com/tribunal/ Eu Nordic & East
I played LoL a lot last year, thus far the tribunal seemed to not have worked. Reporting them by pm or via the forum is the best way to do it for now, maybe you should make it a totally private report instead of a public forum report.
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hi to all
now we should just make a step back and watch what will happened. the admins and programmer of this game can do what they want. and I guess, maybe, this can go in a good direction. first of all I did not think that it will, but maybe it is a good way.
let's try it. enjoy and relax. give it a chance. for sure, none of us would like to see this game dead (maybe almost all).
so maybe in the future, when the players are growing (what a nice expression :)) then they will maybe accept the modded servers like they do already, but maybe with half honor counting and not with nothing.
but until then, just go and fight and kill all the cheating noobs.
and enjoy the game!
A big thanks to Merlin for disagreeing with the decision but understanding and accepting it. His level of maturity and gratitude is what all AA players should strive to have.
Also, if discouraging mods turns out to be a horrible decision and the vast majority of players leave rapidly, I'm sure Jonny will do something to remedy that. Bottom line is, you need players to keep a game alive.
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Oh come on you have all been stating this: "People choose sf guns and stuff because it's easy to shoot with that scope".
A noob will be able to campp and rpg u without alot of problems, but now only oldschool pro's are back so newbies don't even have a chance with that m16. Dont try to find arguments who aren't true
Even veterans have forgotten how to use m16 like most of the people who played modded servers i really don't want to argue here.
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Also, if discouraging mods turns out to be a horrible decision and the vast majority of players leave rapidly
U GUYS WORRY TO MUCH. GETTING RID OF MODS REMINDS ME OF THE FEARS RESTAURANT
AND CLUB OWNERS HAD WHEN THEY DECIDED TO FORBID SMOKING. THEY THOUGHT THE
JOINTS WOULD GO BANKRUPT AND THEY WERE INDEED EMPTY FOR A SHORT TIME,
BUT THEN PEOPLE GOT USED TO IT AND NOW THEY ARE EVEN MORE ATTENDED
THAN BEFORE THE BAN :up:
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I hope that's the way it goes zoxee.
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noone asked for my 2 cents vut I would still like to spit it. in my personal opinion (even thought I was a 82nd clan member, but now M@FiOsO) I think it would be good to allow 2 official modded servers ( 1 being 82nd Pipe and the other HeadHunters Insurgent camp) but i do realize that if that was done then other server owners would say " well they are official, why can't we, its not fair" but perosnally I don't like modded servers myself. Occasional fc I thik is ok, but modded? No. I understand the "modded server killed AA" theory. And I can say I played AA since it first came out, but it didn't kill it. what killed it was people not patient enough (yeah we have lives outside AA) to stay in a non modded server to get players to join. another thing (I'm not talking shit to the devs of assist) is the lack of updates. we use to enjoy the the patches each mnth or 2 when AA was still being supported. A few fixes I reccomend is this.
1: Bridge Construction
OBJ is broken
Can't climb Def Ladder Onto Tower
Add really small amounts of fog (just itty bitty)
2:Breakout
Why are my nades when I throw them from 2nd floor of spawn on def, to 1st floor hallway towards assault spawn or down in main pump hurting my teammates that are postioned on the 3rd floor?
Can We Add A Self heal??
Can we add A sai? enemy spotted but not the glitched version where u can report e's
even though u cannot actually see them.
Can we add a editor made for 2.5 and not have to make maps in 2.8 and convert them to 2.5? (if not then this is ok, just a suggestion)
Can we fix ladder glitch where u get stuck on ladders and can't do anything?
PB!!!! true pb is great. but if the admin pb commands don't work (and hack hunter works better than pb and faster) can we get rid of pb and have hack hunter as our main source for catching hackers so that people aren't getting handshake fails and other pb errors. besides, what's the stats on pb caught hackers and hack hunter caught hackers? what in ur opinon works best?
Also what is progress on updating to other versions other than 2.5? Not necessarily 2.8.5, but are there other versions we could build up to? 2.6? 2.7?
we miss those updates (patches) and we understand all the work is done free of charge without using Pragmatic (Pay for honor) But more people will be excited with more frequent updates.
Again, This is all my personal opinion which doesn't mean a hot cow patty in the hot texas summer heat. lol
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Thanks for the post Rapture.
1: Bridge Construction
OBJ is broken
Can't climb Def Ladder Onto Tower
Add really small amounts of fog (just itty bitty)
That should all be easy to fix. I'll add this to a personal list and see that it gets fixed in the next update.
2:Breakout
Why are my nades when I throw them from 2nd floor of spawn on def, to 1st floor hallway towards assault spawn or down in main pump hurting my teammates that are postioned on the 3rd floor?
I have no answer for this. I would have to see it in-game before even guessing as to why it happens.
Can We Add A Self heal??
Can we add A sai? enemy spotted but not the glitched version where u can report e's
even though u cannot actually see them.
Highly unlikely. This would require heavy amounts of coding via UScript and that's pretty much a lost language. A few people still know it but nobody that's willing to work on AA. Jonny, Possessed and me know enough to putter around and compile basic stuff but creating a new mod from scratch is way outside our skillset.
Can we add a editor made for 2.5 and not have to make maps in 2.8 and convert them to 2.5? (if not then this is ok, just a suggestion)
No, for many reasons. The editor could allow hacks to be made easier. It's one that's not public and has files that might be bad if leaked. It is also very buggy and temperamental and would be a strain to explain everything with it to the public. Then we would have to think about what to do when people make maps, how to handle them and allow people to upload them. Would the maps even make the cut? If there were more players and more interest in custom maps, I would probably be motivated to create our own Mission Depot website where everything would be handled. Right now though, I don't see it adding any benefit to the community as most of them don't even play custom maps aside from Pool Day.
Can we fix ladder glitch where u get stuck on ladders and can't do anything?
This goes back to the UScript thing again. Is it a bug? Is it AGP code? Is it engine code? It's probably beyond our knowledge.
PB!!!! true pb is great. but if the admin pb commands don't work (and hack hunter works better than pb and faster) can we get rid of pb and have hack hunter as our main source for catching hackers so that people aren't getting handshake fails and other pb errors. besides, what's the stats on pb caught hackers and hack hunter caught hackers? what in ur opinon works best?
I agree. PB just adds lag and is very bloated with all of the checks. I don't like it but I'm sure Jonny and Possessed would disagree.
Also what is progress on updating to other versions other than 2.5? Not necessarily 2.8.5, but are there other versions we could build up to? 2.6? 2.7?
2.8.5 is pretty much lost unless ELiZ comes back and fixes the brick wall of issues that he ran into. 2.5 is used due to the native code. Jonny got 2.8.5 working on Linux and Mac so 2.6 would be possible as UScript mods were developed for that but I don't know that it would be worthwhile.
we miss those updates (patches) and we understand all the work is done free of charge without using Pragmatic (Pay for honor) But more people will be excited with more frequent updates.
Again, I agree. I love updates. It shows the developers care. There's not a lot to update though. Security is tough because good hacks are paid for and personally, I wouldn't know the first step to detecting one. Updates for the game itself is pretty much impossible since we don't have the source code. Maps are great and that's something I know how to do pretty well but not many people play them. That's why I'm thinking about bug fixes and tuning existing maps without changing gameplay.
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well I have learned html, php, css and java script all in maybe 2-3 weeks. I'm a fast learner. what can I learn that can help assist in adding more development to the game? I'm willing to learn and love AA that much. We have to keep this going with as many updates as we can possibly make. we have to do this for the AA players who cannot afford cpu upgrades to play AA4 when it comes out. Or else im sad to say AA 2.5 will die at that time. And I don't think its right for AA2 to die after all the hard work all of you have put into it. I have both linux - ubuntu (I'm a android developer) and windows cpu. I can help anyway I can if u can point me in the right direction :-)
excuse my typos, I'm typing on my cell because my wife is playing AA on my cpu atm -_-
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Well, AA runs on Unreal Engine 2 so learning UScript and anything with UE2R would help. Assist is built with RealBasic. I'm not really one to say "welcome aboard" or anything. Send a PM to Jonny and Possessed or Sergio and they can tell you more.
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rgr that. I wouldn't want to be officially or unofficially onboard until I have learned as much as I can. thanks for the replies
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Check this out:
http://hyper.dnsalias.net/infobase/archive/wod/tutorials/guide.htm
Then this:
http://wiki.beyondunreal.com/
Ignore UDK/UT3 stuff.
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Perhaps a better pick-a-weap mod would be a more elegant answer. Having different modes such as rifle, machine gun or explosives to stop people from using a rpg when everybody else is having a pistol match. Then maybe allow 1 or 2 people per team to have an AR or something like that.
I have the decompiled uscript for pickaweap and modified it to remove RPGs and grenade choices. Recompiling it with 2.5 is where I got stalled. But I didn't try to hard. In the end, we used hackhunter to limit nades and left the rest in place thinking Assault teams would come up with effective choices, e.g. cover vent, chastise the spawn campers, ect. but we kept getting flooded with those damn new player noob spawn campers.
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I have the decompiled uscript for pickaweap and modified it to remove RPGs and grenade choices. Recompiling it with 2.5 is where I got stalled. But I didn't try to hard. In the end, we used hackhunter to limit nades and left the rest in place thinking Assault teams would come up with effective choices, e.g. cover vent, chastise the spawn campers, ect. but we kept getting flooded with those damn new player noob spawn campers.
That's a good first step but 203 and other weapon imbalances would still be there. I think it needs to be more restricted and count the number of a specific weapon a team has to make sure it's balanced (rifle vs rifle, sniper vs sniper). That's a fair bit of headache.
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Check this out:
http://hyper.dnsalias.net/infobase/archive/wod/tutorials/guide.htm
Then this:
http://wiki.beyondunreal.com/
Ignore UDK/UT3 stuff.
rgr that, many thanks
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I agree. PB just adds lag and is very bloated with all of the checks. I don't like it but I'm sure Jonny and Possessed would disagree.
The main thing being used from PB now are the CVAR checks to make sure noone has illegal keybinds etc. Correct me if I'm wrong.
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We care because we have been loyal to the game.
True loyalty lies in the acceptance in the original design and concept of the game...
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True loyalty lies in the acceptance in the original design and concept of the game...
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True loyalty lies in the acceptance in the original design and concept of the game...
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True loyalty lies in the acceptance in the original design and concept of the game...
To me a "mod" might make a sense only as an organic set of modifications made to create a different gameplay, if you simply add a couple of weapon modification or gameplay modification that do not mix up together you're just going short and easy to make something to work for what you're looking for (which isn't necessarily bad -unless it becomes the standard - but you can't call it as true as the original gameplay).
One of my fav games is Killing Floor. It features likely about more than 30 official weapons and maybe 10 more dlc weapons (without consider the unofficial ones used on custom servers which work on unofficial perks stats precisely because it's a quite different gameplay). Every single weapon is often compared and discussed about being overpowered, overpriced or unbalanced for the overall price/weight/power/operating speed ratio. The game is based on 7 perks (roles), which aren't complete by theirselves but rather complement each other, therefore the balance is really delicate and a single unbalanced tool or "role" will really mess up the overall teamwork and team ability to get through the round.