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Assist => Feedback & Suggestions => Topic started by: ELiZ on Tuesday, March 03, 2015, 03:56:57 AM
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I've added a new poll, asking you what you think about 203 drop shots.
I'm not sure what solution we would choose to disable 203 dropshots, I think we have a couple that would get the job done.
Use this thread to discuss what you think of 203 dropshots.
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I think you talk about long distance 203 that you cant see were it fals. Than wat is the alternatieve.
If this is what i think than on border we quess sometimes were the player runs to on long distance. So we need it
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I think you talk about long distance 203 that you cant see were it fals. Than wat is the alternatieve.
If this is what i think than on border we quess sometimes were the player runs to on long distance. So we need it
What I mean by drop shots are not really long distance, but rather shots that are higher than they are long.
I straight up is 90 degrees, and straight from is 0 degrees, perhaps 75-90 degrees should count as 203 drops.
The exact degree will be experimented on, to find the angle where it counts as a drop.
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What I mean by drop shots are not really long distance, but rather shots that are higher than they are long.
I straight up is 90 degrees, and straight from is 0 degrees, perhaps 75-90 degrees should count as 203 drops.
The exact degree will be experimented on, to find the angle where it counts as a drop.
Why would dropshots be forbidden when long spamshots are allowed?
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Why would dropshots be forbidden when long spamshots are allowed?
I don't know, what do you think?
That is why I added this thread, to get feedback.
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I've only used dropshots 2-3 times in my AA career. I remember I tried to 203 someone over the main entrance on pipe. I obviously failed miserably, but it was a fun try :D
What I just thought would be fun is that if you know someone's following you then to 203 the sky and see him blow up a minute later or something :D
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I'm not sure what solution we would choose to disable 203 dropshots, I think we have a couple that would get the job done.
Courtyard doesnt allows dropshots, works well.
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I do believe it's not possible to do dropshots on most (if not all) newer maps. The ceiling is just in the way. Urban Assault with 203's or rockets is a good example - you can see it explode in the map ceiling.
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If you stand below the hill whit your 203 is possible to peg a player uphill. So thats a drop shot up to hit one
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let it like it is now.
as teddy did say, only possible on few maps like mountain pass, bridge..
on the most maps, you can shoot but they will not come down at all :D
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I do not see why people want it removed
- Smart players will be able to dodge it
- Less straight 203s to your face, let them waste them
- Only people sitting at certain obvious spots all the time will get killed.
Why remove it?
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Why would dropshots be forbidden when long spamshots are allowed?
x2
While playing floodgate people would throw a nade over side of building, never seeing an enemy, at start simply because they know people spawn there. So I tried sending a 203 drop shot back to them with nothing ever exploding. lol oh well.
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Bridge defenders already hold all the cards so leave Bridge out of this poll please
and yeah therefore my no vote
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I voted "no". I don't eaven remember how to do most of them, but I support all the players that are still able to do them.
Becides, they are not Always spamshots. On Bridge, when en enemy is on middle top, I still know how to hit the middle top with a dropshot. I see this as a skill and I only do it when I know that there's an enemy on top of middle.
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Are you talking about all maps or just bridge?
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In general, not only Bridge.
There are not many maps that this still can be done anyway. From what I know, it's:
Bridge
Bridge SE
Mountain Pass
(probably) Mountain Pass SE
maybe a few more old maps that I couldn't think of. Well I know you can use it on Pipeline if you don't try to shoot it over the building, but it's quite useless this way...
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Hello,
Coming from a Bridge playing clan, we had lots of drop shots down to a fine art, better when there was two 203's.
When we strayed off the Bridge, we still used drop shots on some of the other maps.
I personally have never fired a real 203. If you can use a real 203 in the same manner ( basically a mortar ) then it should be left as is, as this was how the real US Army wanted it.
Steve
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This is what I read:
The M203 could engage a window sized target out to 150 meters and an area type target out to 450 meters.
The standard 40x46mm high explosive grenade has an effective casualty radius of 5 meters. The effective casualty radius is defined as the radius of a circle about the point of detonation in which it may be expected that 50 percent of exposed troops will become casualties. Safe-weapon practices for firing the M203 grenade launcher require a minimum safe distance of 130 meters for high explosive rounds, and 165 meters for HEDP. Range regulations stipulate that all targets have to be more than 200 meters away. The danger radius of the high explosive grenades is 130 meters (427 feet).
I have seen people firing up straight in the air behind arch or stairs and the dropshot only comes down after a significant amount of time - so this to me doesn't make sense if the first sentence (blue) is true. The dropshots that are fired straight up in the game must actually travel
a few kilometers taking the time it takes for them to come down.
I don't think the launcher has the strength to perform such shots.
And these shots I would define as the dropshots in question cause they are being fired at an angle of 75 degrees or higher
So in my opinion these dropshots (in real life) are a bit far fetched - correct me if I am wrong
Lord-of-War :style:
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teddy should know - he is a mathematician ;)
Lord-of-War :style:
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You dont get to practice firing on the excat lines on travel that the enemy takes every time in real life. This is for children no skill required just practice to make perfect. I never done it in game much. I resoreted to this when someone was to good for me. Its garbage. Where in real life can you stick a camara on the nade to see where it lands, This is for none players and children. On any map.
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teddy should know - he is a mathematician ;)
Lord-of-War :style:
I'm a physicist, at least in thoery.
But I'll answer anyway.
This is what I read:
The M203 could engage a window sized target out to 150 meters and an area type target out to 450 meters.
The standard 40x46mm high explosive grenade has an effective casualty radius of 5 meters. The effective casualty radius is defined as the radius of a circle about the point of detonation in which it may be expected that 50 percent of exposed troops will become casualties. Safe-weapon practices for firing the M203 grenade launcher require a minimum safe distance of 130 meters for high explosive rounds, and 165 meters for HEDP. Range regulations stipulate that all targets have to be more than 200 meters away. The danger radius of the high explosive grenades is 130 meters (427 feet).
I have seen people firing up straight in the air behind arch or stairs and the dropshot only comes down after a significant amount of time - so this to me doesn't make sense if the first sentence (blue) is true. The dropshots that are fired straight up in the game must actually travel
a few kilometers taking the time it takes for them to come down.
I don't think the launcher has the strength to perform such shots.
And these shots I would define as the dropshots in question cause they are being fired at an angle of 75 degrees or higher
So in my opinion these dropshots (in real life) are a bit far fetched - correct me if I am wrong
Lord-of-War :style:
I don't know exactly where you read this, but I hope it's a reliable source (it does look reasonable and wikipedia reports similar numbers).
What you need to understand is that the range you were reading about is effective range. That is the range at which you could actually engage a target.
It doesn't mean the M203 will not travel further. It means you would not expect to hit anything. At least in real life.
Now, shooting it straight up or even at 45 degrees is something that probably something nobody in a combat situation would do. Straight up is just firing at yourself and at 45 degrees you really wouldn't know where it lands. It will probably go significantly further than 450 meters, but since it's not practiced for more than 450m, you will probably have no clew where it lands.
As for shooting straight up, I know it takes quite a long time to come back in the game. But it is expected. The 203 looses it's momentum going up until it gets to 0 and then it starts to gain momentum towards the ground because of gravity. All of this will take quite a while.
I also know that the US Army used actual weapons to make this game, so I would expect the intial velocity of the projectile is what it is in real life (or close to it). I doubt air resistance is taken into consideration in AA, but it doesn't really matter that much.
Both the initial velocity as well as the maximum height can be directly calculated from the time it took for the 203 to fall down (without taking into account air resistance and assuming the same gravitational constant as in real life).
EDIT:Fixed a few idiotic things :)
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Weapon acuracy can be changed to make it shoot more randomly.
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I'm a physicist, at least in thoery.
But I'll answer anyway.
I don't know exactly where you read this, but I hope it's a reliable source (it does look reasonable and wikipedia reports similar numbers).
What you need to understand is that the range you were reading about is effective range. That is the range at which you could actually engage a target.
It doesn't mean the M203 will not travel further. It means you would not expect to hit anything. At least in real life.
Now, shooting it straight up or even at 45 degrees is something that probably something nobody in a combat situation would do. Straight up is just firing at yourself and at 45 degrees you really wouldn't know where it lands. It will probably go significantly further than 450 meters, but you since it's not practices for more than 450m, you will probably have no clew where it lands.
As for shooting straight up, I know it takes quite a long time to come back in the game. But it is expected. The 203 looses it's momentum going up until it gets to 0 and then it starts to gain momentum towards the ground because of gravity. All of this will take quite a while.
I also know that the US Army used actual weapon charctarisations to make this game, so I would expect the intial velocity of the projectile is what it is in real life (or close to it). I doubt air resisdence is taken into consideration in AA, but it doesn't really matter that much.
Both the initial velocity as well as the maximum height can be directly calculated from the time it took for the 203 to fall down (without taking into account air resisdance and assuming the same gravitational constant as in real life).
My apologies in advance for interjecting... but...
This post is the most awkward post I've ever read with respect to physics...
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I personally have never fired a real 203. If you can use a real 203 in the same manner ( basically a mortar ) then it should be left as is, as this was how the real US Army wanted it.
i did that in my military time, more then once. and you can use it in the same way like on bridge. so its realistic.
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How about accuracy?
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My apologies in advance for interjecting... but...
This post is the most awkward post I've ever read with respect to physics...
Yeah, I was in a lecture, was trying to listen to the lecturer as well. I guess neither ended up good :D
i did that in my military time, more then once. and you can use it in the same way like on bridge. so its realistic.
Well there are different ways you can use it on Bridge.
You can shoot it at an angle up to (I guess) 30 degrees to hit an enemy 150-450 meters away.
Or you can shoot it at 85 degrees to hit the enemy behind a hill or something.
Which did you use?
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i did that in my military time, more then once. and you can use it in the same way like on bridge. so its realistic.
We know spam nading happens in real life. BUT you dont get to practice were the ene,my will be running to every time you like. That is noyt realistic,
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It is not a problem with 203 itselfs but with "GameRules"
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We all fell in love with the game how it was made. You guys already edited existing maps like hospital to change the gameplay instead of creating a new SF hospital without M203. I never spammed 203's in hospital, but they sure were usefull somethimes. I still have the reflex to press the button and then I remember that it's just not the same.
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It looks like there is no support for a global disable of dropshots.
I'm however adding a Server Admin Option to enable it if they want.
At the moment, we are still experimenting, I have it enabled on my Test server(BC SFMod), as I never wanted to learn dropshots, I'm not really the right person to test the function. So I was wondering if you could join the server and try out some dropshots, and report back with what pitch angle was detected.
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It looks like there is no support for a global disable of dropshots.
What do you mean ? You taling abot the poll?
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What do you mean ? You taling abot the poll?
Yes.
There is no way that a such a drastic change should be made when the vote is so close.
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Just the way you said no support its not accurate really. Its almost 50-50. But thats fine. I like the server thats running just now. It kicks you for early nades .
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nice ELiZ, good for that option. i will not use it, but maybe others.
and i am also not the person for dropshots. but i know some doing this really good - from our clan. i will tell them to test.
@teddy: if i would have tried the shoots at 85 degrees, i would not be here anymore :)
i did try several kinds of dropshoots at my military time (special forces, in Switzerland called "Grenadier") i was 2 years there, a very hard time and long time ago :). with my personal rifle i could shoot even over small parts of trees or hills, about 200 meters away. and you could hit a target like a car. there was a special way to select the distance befor you did shoot. also for shooting a cable over a river or so to have a start for building a bridge. other weapons which can do this are rare, but most of the granade launcher can do this, but not with this precision.